The Mastering Podcast

Mastering Speed: Unpacking Elite Sprint Performance with Reece Holder & Dr. Christopher Dale | Part One

• The Mastering Team • Season 1 • Episode 13

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The 400-meter sprint might be the most punishing event in track and field—a brutal combination of raw speed and lactic acid endurance that pushes athletes to their absolute limits. In this captivating conversation, our hosts Don Sanka Small and Magnus Olsen sit down with Australian Olympic sprinter Reece Holder and his coach, Dr. Christopher Dale. We dive deep into the physical and mental challenges of mastering this iconic distance.

Reece takes us through the jaw-dropping reality of running the first 200 meters in under 21 seconds—a split that would win many standalone 200m races—before battling through what athletes call "the pain cave." As he candidly shares, "I just genuinely find it funny. I mean, I'm running these times and people are complaining about the weight and height that I am." Standing at 6'4" and 96kg, Holder represents a new paradigm for 400m runners, traditionally a leaner build.

Dr. Dale offers fascinating insights into the science behind different athlete profiles—"flyers" versus "diesels"—and how coaching strategies must adapt to harness each athlete's unique strengths. His approach combines rigorous data analysis with a deep understanding of human psychology, creating a training environment where talent flourishes.

The conversation provides a masterclass in resilience. Reece recounts how he overcame multiple serious injuries, missed international opportunities due to COVID, and continues to balance elite training with work and university studies. When Don asks about his competitive mindset, Reece shares a telling story of running through a torn hip flexor to win a national final at age 15, demonstrating the mental fortitude essential for success at the highest level.

Whether you're an athlete, coach, or simply fascinated by high performance, this episode offers rare insights into what separates the elite from the merely excellent. The key takeaway? As Dr. Dale puts it when asked about the traits every athlete must possess: "Belief and hunger. I don't think you can have one without the other."

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Don:

Did you just say you run the first 200 in 21 seconds.

Reece:

Yeah, sub 21 seconds. At the Olympics I split 20.88 in my heat run. Then my last 400 I did in Tokyo. I split about 21 flat as well, so around that time for the first 200. I just genuinely find it funny. I mean, I'm running these times and people are complaining about the weight and the height that I am. Um, I mean, the oz record's going to go down this year, so they'll all be sending more stuff when, when, that goes down you know, we're in the, we're in the arena doing the things and they're behind the keyboard.

Chris:

That's a good answer. That's a good answer and grace is just a natural competitor and he's always been like that. I think a really good story is. I think he was. He might have been 15 when you tore your TFL sorry, he tore one of the smaller hip flexor muscles in a national final of a 400 and he just kept running. He won the race. He kept running.

Magnus:

What does it take to become one of the fastest men in Australia and who are the minds behind that kind of performance? In this episode of the Mastering Podcast, I'm joined by my favourite co-host, don Sanker. Welcome, mate. And our guest. Today we're joined by Rhys Holder, australia's rising sprint sensation, and his coach, dr Christopher Dale, a performance scientist and sprint strategist who's helped shape Rhys into a world-class athlete. Today we'll unpack the mindset, mechanics and mastery behind elite performance. This is just not about running fast. It's about discipline, data, adversity and inner belief. Whether you're an athlete, a coach or someone chasing greatness in your own lane, this episode will leave you inspired and equipped to push your limits. Welcome to the podcast boys.

Chris:

Thank you very much. Thanks for having us on.

Don:

Come on boys, this is going to be interesting.

Magnus:

All right, can you just give us a defining moment, when you first thought hey, I'm actually pretty good at this.

Reece:

I'd say always through school. I was pretty decent at track, winning your, you know, your school carnivals and stuff and sort of just transcended from there really.

Magnus:

Yeah, and did you always have a real inner belief in yourself, or did that come a little bit later on?

Reece:

I would say it came a lot later on. But I've got a bit of dog in me which always helps in races and stuff, so I'd say that's sort of where it's come from for sure, which always helps in races and stuff. So I'd say that's sort of where it's come from for sure.

Don:

Matt, you need a lot of dog in you to run a 400. It's probably one of the hardest sports. That's what Don keeps telling us. Matt. I've run behind this guy for years so I know how hard it is and how much work he puts in and how much work this guy makes everyone put in. So it is a hard race. It's probably, I would say, one of the hardest in the track and field discipline.

Chris:

Yeah, probably a toss-up between the well, it depends on who runs each event. I'll tell you theirs is the hardest. But yeah, the 400, the 800 or the 400-minute hurdles, it's probably vying for the top.

Don:

I've got two out of the three. Oh, you're going to step it up to the 800, are you?

Chris:

Might find some success there too. Yeah, I don't think so, Probably not no, but yeah I think. Yeah, it's between those three events, and all of them are hard. Really, at the elite level there's no easy events.

Don:

What makes it so hard Like there's so many other ones that are 1,500 is longer, 200 needs and the 100 metres needs so much energy strength. What makes the 400 and the 400 hurdle? It seems like that distance.

Chris:

It's just the physiology, so it's the time duration of the event. So, because we're sort of you're running at your anaerobic sort of capacity or peak power, that's when you start. I'm sure everyone all the listeners out there try to do like a maximal 30 second run or a bike test and you start to feel a bit sick. The legs go heavy. Well, the guys that do this event, they feel that before they hit the home straight and they've got to keep going with that feeling. So you can imagine an 800, you know they're not running at the absolute velocity of these 400 metre runners, it's still pretty fast, so they're used to enduring pain.

Magnus:

So what you're saying is that that 30 second mark that's when most people are experiencing that lactic threshold, when you're going at full noise and then you've got to keep that up for another 200 metres. Is that one of the things that makes it more difficult? Just from a layman's sense?

Chris:

Yeah, yeah, You're reaching the limits of that part of our physiology and you really start to feel the burn. So it's more that depending on what one-word event you do is how long it takes, but how fast you are as well, means that, say, someone like Rhys, he can sort of reach that 30-second mark at like 285-ish metres where I don't know. I would hate to see me try to do a 400. It probably wouldn't be too pretty and I'd probably feel the pain down the back straight.

Don:

I want to see him hitting the 300 mark under 31 seconds. That'll be that.

Chris:

He's broken the world record if he does that Well, darren Clark's at 31, right, 31.8.

Don:

Oh, there you go 31.8.

Chris:

That's the next target.

Reece:

That's the next target, for sure, yeah, nice.

Chris:

But yeah, to answer your question, magnus, it's just that you know, depending on how fast you are, if the fast you are, obviously it's painful, but it's potentially less painful because you've got longer in that pain cave.

Don:

Can I ask then, if you break down the 400, explain it? I actually want to hear it from you, and from you from two different perspectives.

Chris:

I think it'd be good to hear the athlete perspective first. I think let's go.

Reece:

So breaking down. So I'd say first 100 is just come out and push, push hard how hard do you go?

Don:

like you, you got the starting blocks. 100 meters is is go for. Go for your heart. Do you go that up that hard?

Reece:

no, not necessarily. I'd say it'd probably sit about the or like the 90, 90 to 92 percent um, around the first hundred and into the back straight, because I've been, I've been going through. The first two is about 20 sub sub 21 at the moment um and my, my pb for 200 currently sits at 20.4. Uh, so I'd say, yeah, probably around that 90 percent.

Don:

So I'd say probably around that 90%. Did you just say you run the first 200 in 21 seconds?

Reece:

Yeah, sub-21 seconds. At the Olympics I split 20.88 in my heat run, then my last 400 I did in Toka split about 21 flat as well. So around that time for the first 200. And then you get into the back of the top of the curve, try to keep everything together momentum through the curve and then just I guess everything breaks loose for that last 100 and just try to hold on really and keep everything stacked underneath you and just push really.

Don:

And put it into perspective. Majority of people can't even run a 200 at under 21 seconds. He's talking about running 200 in 21 seconds with another 200 left to go.

Magnus:

I guess that's the difference, why he's elite.

Don:

Well, it's next level of elite Olympic athlete. So, Chris, in your point of view, how do you break that down?

Chris:

Well, there's two ways. So this isn't my idea, it's from the Dutch national coach, laurent Muley, and I think he puts it really well. So there's two types of ways that you can run two athletes or two athlete profiles. You've got flyers, who are people who are more naturally fast, and you've got people he calls diesels, which are maybe those who are more naturally fast, and you've got people he calls diesels, which are maybe those who are maybe not as fast but are better at maybe enduring or can churn out maybe like 500 repetitions or 600 repetitions in training, and they can, you know, do a fair few of them.

Chris:

Reese is not one of those athletes, as we've sort of already discussed. He's definitely more of the, the faster type of athlete. But those two athlete profiles will have you want to run the event in a way that caters to your strengths. So a flyer, using this sort of categorization so what race is will run faster through the first 200 and they'll, you know, they'll hit fatigue potentially a little bit earlier, but their goal is to be further in front of the competition, to then hold on whereas a diesel is maybe a little bit more conservative through the first 200 and lets everyone maybe go away from them and then sort of maybe will reel them in in that last 200. So I think the Olympic Games last year I'm sure we all saw the 400 metre final in the men's.

Don:

One of the craziest 400 finals.

Chris:

Ridiculous runs ever. But Quincy Hall, who won the gold medal, and Reece actually competed against in his heat.

Don:

That famous photo of mate. I want to ask about that later, but you go on. But his.

Chris:

So his differential so what we call the if we compare the time for the first 200 and the last 200, was very, very close to one another, meaning that he's not really slowing down too much, where someone like Reece might have a 2.8 to 3 second differential, meaning he's slowing down more. So, based on those strategies and the athlete, there's ways that you run it. So what Rhys has described is how most people who are those flyers will run. So get out a bit harder, play to your strengths, try to hold on. Where the diesel is more about staying fluid and composed and trying to run over the top of people.

Magnus:

What's the difference between scientifically and biomechanically, between those two different types of athletes?

Chris:

The really short answer of it is that the flyer, or the people who are more faster athletes, will just be better at producing power. So in terms of their muscle architecture, they'll look a little bit different. So you know, in terms of their muscle architecture, they'll look a little bit different. You know, rhys is probably, I'd say you're almost the biggest 400-meter runner on the world stage. Just because what are you? 96 kilos and six foot. What did you say you were?

Reece:

Six foot four. Six foot four.

Chris:

So that's a very, very big person and you know that's sort of the size, that, because Shane Thompson is who runs 100 meters, whereas the Dies the size that keshane thompson is, he runs 100 meters, whereas the, the diesels, are more of that greyhound style physique where they're usually much more leaner, longer tendons, less less dense muscle. Um, so yeah, it's a very visual difference. You can usually tell just by by eyeballing. But yeah, if we're just doing a test like just you know, regular, just power outputs in in various exercises, whether that's in the gym or on a bike, like for a 30 second test or you know, just even a pure sprinting velocity perspective, there the the flyer is is just better at all those things traditionally a 400 meter runner has been a been lean and, you know, not look like a hundred meter runner.

Don:

Uh, there's been a few keyboard warriors that's tried to give you advice on how to.

Chris:

We love the keyboard warriors.

Don:

What do you say to them? Six foot four, the way you can run. If you can be that powerful, I'll take that any day.

Chris:

I don't really pay too much attention to them.

Don:

Let's imagine you are paying attention to them. I'd rather not.

Chris:

But there's a reason why we're in the arena doing the things and they're behind the keyboard.

Don:

That's a good answer. 100%, that's a good answer.

Chris:

I think Reece might have an interesting perspective on that.

Reece:

I wouldn't say I have an interesting perspective. I just genuinely find it funny. I mean I'm running these times and people are complaining about the weight and the height that I am. I mean the Oz record's going to go down this year, so they'll all be sending more stuff when that goes down, so I guess we'll just have to see really. But yeah, I mean for me to do this. At this weight I can generate some serious power outputs and I mean run some crazy splits, so I mean it's working for me, so that's all that matters.

Don:

Man, I love your confidence. That's, I've got to say. Athletics, track and field in Australia is absolutely firing. Yeah, I don't think it is. I've never seen anything like this and I'm so glad I'm right here watching this. All of the sprint records are at risk and you guys are breaking some of the most iconic times. Like Patrick Johnson, I'm sure he's excited to see it go. I love the guy, I love what he did, the only Australian to run under 10 seconds, and if I don't see that go down in the next two years or in the next 12 months, I'll be surprised. And we saw the 200 go. And that's another legendary 200 from a legend, iconic legend. And then Darren Clark Right, that's, you were there. You were there. Why did you slow down? Tell me a bit about that. Right I'm? I'm screaming, yeah, I'm screaming at this screen. I said what are you doing? What are you looking around for?

Reece:

making through the rounds and making the final and actually being competitive on a world stage, because that's something that we strive for is actually being competitive on a world stage, not just going there to compete as a number um. So the idea behind why I slowed down was I knew that I just had to be top, top three to make it through into the semi-final. I know because I didn't see anyone. I knew I'd run a really strong first 300. I looked around and I knew I was going to cross the line in top three and that was just my secured ticket to the semifinal. The idea behind it was trying to save as much energy as I could for the day after, because that's where 400 rounds really kills you is if you waste too much energy, you're gone Did you know that the record was there?

Don:

Did you know you ran that fast?

Reece:

No, to be honest, I thought I didn't think it was that fast. I probably thought it was about 40, 45 low. I didn't realize it was 40, 44, 5. I was just, I was just, I had to say, I was informed and just hot and ready to go.

Don:

To give a bit of context, that was the second fastest time an Australian has ever run over the 400 meters and by far one of the best races. And he slowed down like you slowed down in that and you were in front of the guy who won the 400 final. There's this iconic photo where I think even he was taken aback. He was like looking at you like who the hell is this kid? And there's no doubt in my mind and Chris, I'm sure you agree if he didn't slow down, the record was gone.

Reece:

I would like to think so. I guess there'd be some critics and some keyboard warriors out there, but I think from memory it was about 70, 70 to 80 metres or so. I sort of slowed down and started looking around. So in my head, if I went straight through the line, that would have been gone for sure. This is at the Olympics.

Magnus:

I think it's great, mate. You just keep doing your talking on the track and let the keyboard warriors do their thing. Definitely I want to touch on sacrifices, because I don't think a lot of people really fully understand what you have to miss out on to be an elite professional athlete. So can you just give us a little run through what a typical training week looks like for you and some of the things that you have to say no to?

Reece:

So a typical training week for me is so Monday train on the track. Monday, tuesday, thursday and Saturday, so it's about nine to 11. I'm normally in on the track at about eight to get ready, actually get ready for training and get my body moving and make sure it's okay, um, and then so Monday and Mond and thursdays we have gym straight after training, um, so I typically finish about one o'clock, um, and then that's more sort of for training wise. But every day after training I'm normally working or got uni on, because for me track doesn't pay my bills and I have to have to still work. But it is what it is. And then on top of that you still have your ice baths, sauna, recovery sessions, just general rolling and stretching and triggering and stuff like that.

Reece:

But sacrifice is probably just a lot of time and a lot of you don't see your friends as often as you'd like and there's a lot of events and stuff that you always have to say no to. I mean, I don't go out and drink every weekend, but I would say there's a lot of sacrifice. You've got to put a future career, potential career, on hold. I'm currently only doing one subject at uni, so uni's prolonged a long time. But yeah, I'd say there's definitely a lot you've got to sacrifice for it.

Magnus:

Well, with a bit of luck, if anyone's listening out there that wants to sponsor this young man, then yeah, get in contact with us.

Don:

We'll touch on the sponsorships and some of those sacrifices and the financial side of it a bit later on. The thing I want to touch a bit on, Chris like we talk about the athlete sacrifice all the time, the people that don't get the recognition are the coaches, especially in Australia. You've done a PhD.

Chris:

I've done a master's. You've done a master's. Sorry, corrected, you've done a master's. I don't have time for a PhD.

Don:

With everything you're doing. You're an exercise physiologist, You've done your master's. You could well and truly go into allied health and make a shitload of money, but you choose to do this thing where you don't get the. You're not in front of the camera or get the recognition. You're in the background. So why?

Chris:

That's a good question. I don't know.

Don:

And what are the sacrifices you have to make as a coach?

Chris:

I think I've got a bit of a controversial opinion about whether, with sacrifices, I actually don't think it's a sacrifice.

Chris:

What I think it is is just me being very selfish in choosing to pursue my interest at the potential, I guess, being more lucrative. So I'm a registered osteopath, so I could earn a lot more money if I was working full-time in a clinic and doing what osteos do. But I choose to not do that so I can pursue my interest and something that I think that you know I'm much better suited to or more adept to with the way that I think about things and my problem-solving skills. So I, you know, I don't think it's a sacrifice that I do that. I think it's selfish that I choose to do this over other things. I choose to do this over other things. But, to answer your question, don a lot of what I do behind the scenes for Reece's success so far and the other athletes that I coach. It's just a lot of people see the success that they're having now, but a lot of the seeds that we planted for this were done, sort of you know, five years ago, six years ago.

Chris:

And then me as a coach like I think I had to work this out for an Instagram Q&A that I did earlier today, and I think I've been coaching for about 18 years and you know I'm only 34, but you know I started as a development. You know coaching kids and like learn to play athletics sort of stuff, but you know.

Chris:

But it just takes time and people see the results now, but I didn't start coaching to do this, it just happened. But it's the process of getting involved in it and learning how to coach, and learning how to work with people and finding your interest and you know the tough questions that stubbornly I want to answer.

Magnus:

What did get?

Chris:

you started in coaching, so my mum.

Don:

Sharon, she's sort of always been involved in athletics. One of the legends of Queensland athletics.

Chris:

So my great-grandparents. Actually they're from Victoria, so they're from Box Hill, and my great-grandmother actually founded the women's athletics part of Box Hill Athletics Club down there and the gym and the pavilion is actually named after them. So, like, my family has been around the sport for a long time. But when I was I can't even remember how old I was, but we were involved in athletics. I got involved because my older brother went and did it and I just happened to go, and then, because I was around it, I enjoyed it and I wanted to do it. But then my mum got involved in coaching because some other kids at the centre wanted to coach and asked her, you know, could she help them out? Because they heard that she used to be an athlete. So she got started in coaching, not because of us, her own children, but just because of being around it.

Chris:

And then I actually got injured. I fractured my leg, I think I was 16 or something. And then I got roped into coaching the eight-year-olds for something to do because I couldn't train. And then, you know, I guess I caught the coaching bug or something. But yeah, and it just started from there and, you know, one thing led to another and I stopped competing myself because I was I think I was 26 or 27 or something.

Magnus:

What events did you compete in?

Chris:

Well, I did all of them when I was younger, but you know predominantly through high school and then when I finished school and, like in my early 20s, around the 100 metres.

Don:

What was your time in the?

Chris:

100? So I ran 10.48 to my PB, but I ran a windy 10.45 as well, but in the grand scheme of things that's not that good. At the time Australian sprinting was a bit weak and that was top 10 for the year, but these days I think that's probably not even 20th.

Magnus:

Realistically, though, there'd be less than 5% of the population could run 100 under 11 seconds.

Chris:

Statistically, though, there'd be less than 5% of the population could run 100 under 11 seconds.

Reece:

Yeah, I don't know the exact numbers but it could be close.

Chris:

But you know, the levels of performance that we're talking about with the athletes that I actually coach is like I don't even know the percentage, but it's such a small fraction of the population. It's the elite of the elite and, like you know, there's eight lanes or nine lanes on a track and there's 90,000 seats for a reason, so that's why I stopped.

Magnus:

That's a great way to put it. Potential what did you see in Reece? What are the little things like? Just touching on what you just did? So the elite of the elite, how do you try and identify? What are the little qualities?

Chris:

I think probably the biggest one is just like the mental aptitude and being able to handle misfortune and handle things not going your way, because you can try to teach it. But I think a lot of it is inherent and Rhys is just a natural competitor and he's always been like that. I think a really good story is I think he was. He might have been 15 when you tore your TFL. Sorry yeah.

Reece:

Was he 15?. Under 16.

Chris:

Yeah, so he was 15 or 16, and he tore one of the smaller hip flexor muscles in a national final of a 400 and he just kept running. And you know he won the race but he kept running, yeah yeah, I was winning, so that's what I did.

Reece:

Yeah, yeah so it's just.

Chris:

it's things like that and I don't. You know, people have tried to hack long-term athletic development and find the next Bolt or the next Michael Phelps, but it just doesn't work. It just doesn't. And what you need to do is just you need to find the people with the right attitudes and the people who can compete, people who can accept criticism, people who want to be better, and then if you get groups of people that are like that together and you just commit to improving everything that you do, there's no coincidence that a high level of success just happens. How much does that play into it? You know, there's no coincidence that you know high level success just happens yeah, how much does that have play into it?

Don:

because if you look at your squad, I I trained with um chris for about four, four or four and a half years. I still train with him in my strength and conditioning and he's also the person who keeps me in one piece whenever I fall apart. So I've gone back to running 400 hurdles again one of those tough ones at my age. His advice is not to do it, probably because he doesn't want to keep patching me up. One of the things I found that was very different to everywhere else I've seen is the community that you build with your squad. It's very different and there's a very discerning sort of a way you do things. How much do you think that builds into the performance of each of the athletes, because Reece is not the only world-class athlete you've got?

Chris:

Yeah, I'm very, very fortunate. And I think, reece, you know, we've got a few athletes, we've got in the 400 metres, we've got Terrell Thorne, so he's just turned 18.

Don:

How good is that kid? I met him when he was 15.

Chris:

Yeah, 15 or 16. So Terrell is… Silk Smooth as silk.

Chris:

Yeah, yeah, so he was…. So Reece, as we just mentioned, he's just come back from the World Relay Champs in China and the Australian teams qualified all of the 4x4 teams for World Champs, which is just a huge effort for everyone involved in the event. But obviously Reece was in that squad, but Terrell, he's 18. He last year broke the under-18 Australian record at the National All-Scores around 45.6, which is just a crazy time because, if we put it in the context of this discussion, reece and I were in 46.4 at the same age. So it's a huge, huge performance and it was a 20 or 30-year-old record. It was a very old record. But he's also in the group and you know he doesn't train like Reece does, but he's around the group and he's, you know, in the environment that we're creating. I've got Ebony Lane, who's a 100-metre sprinter, who was in the women's 4x100m squad for Paris. She wasn't selected to compete but was the lead-off leg for the team that qualified for the Olympics. She's in Japan as we speak, actually about to race this weekend.

Don:

She's been very consistent. She's had an injury and come back.

Chris:

Yeah, yeah, but it's always hard when a new athlete comes into this environment and they're not used to the intensity of the training but also the intensity of what the environment that I create for training demands. And she's well adept to it now and she has really embraced it and since then has really come on leaps and bounds since she's been injured.

Magnus:

So, rhys, speaking about Paris Olympics, how did you feel when you first got selected? And just take us through that experience for you Of being selected.

Don:

Being selected yeah.

Reece:

I think my experience is probably not experience a bit different, but so I ran my qualifying time in China in 2023 at World Uni Games and then I was like, oh, I had just automatically assumed I was going to be selected for the Olympics because I had ran the qualifying time and then, due to injuries, I missed out on the nationals the following year, but no one else was in the quota or had run the time. And then, due to injuries, I missed out on the nationals the following year, but no one else was in the quota or had run the time. So in my mind, I had just automatically been selected.

Reece:

I don't know if that's bad in my part, so I didn't really have any big praise or celebrations as to being selected, because I just thought I was in the team. But the overall experience was ecstatic Like I still can't put words on it to this day just like being treated like that high-level athlete and seeing you know, people you look up to for years and years, being in the same environment as them, training around them, doing pretty much the same thing they're doing. It's a yeah, it's a money-can't-buy experience for sure.

Magnus:

And what about? What was the highlight for you over there?

Reece:

Probably walking out in front of the stadium, you know, on the purple track, and just seeing was it 80 or 90,000 people and just there watching nine lanes go around the track. So it was definitely a surreal experience.

Don:

And I want to double click on to your early days a little bit. We touched you, started winning a 16, ran with an injury finish, but I think when I first started with you guys you were just after COVID. So you talk about mental aptitude and resilience. You know that was your year that you would have made that huge breakthrough running for the world juniors. That's a righteous part of it, yeah.

Chris:

I think, like a lot of people, downplay the impact that these two years had on a lot of athletes around the world. So in 2020 was when Reece was selected for the world under 20 championships and then ultimately, 2020 happened and no one got to go anywhere. But then they had the make-up for the following year and they decided to have that in Kenya, of all places, in Nairobi. So then Reece again was selected, again for that, but then, because of security concerns, australia didn't travel. So Reece was selected for two under-20 teams. That would have created a performance environment for a very big performance because of his competitive nature we've already discussed but he didn't have that, so that not just him, but a lot of athletes got put back a year or two in their development because of it.

Don:

Yeah, if you look at Terrell, God, God and even Vazala from South Africa, all of these boys that last World Junior Games, that was their breakout moment. It created that environment. Right, Missing that, coming out disappointed, it's not being, as you said, selected once, selected twice and still couldn't get there. How did you keep going from there? And what did you have to do just to get back? Because after that then you had a few injuries.

Reece:

um I'd say, obviously it was. It was pretty gutting, um, being selected twice, you know, for a world team and they not even they didn't even send it. They didn't end up sending a team. So it was, it was gutting, but I think just because my the nature of me being a competitor and wanting to run fast times and race people, that's probably why I stuck to the sport, because I think I did see something in myself where I could go further and really be pushing people on the world stage, which is what I want to do. What was the other part of the question?

Don:

The injuries that came after that, you know, did that play a part in what happened after that for the next couple of years?

Reece:

I wouldn't say that. No, I wouldn't say it played a part.

Don:

Injuries injuries happen as an athlete unfortunately psychologically like how did it all sort of play into the next couple of years?

Reece:

so was it 2022? I did, was it back in, did my back and knee.

Don:

Yeah, it was, you had the, and I remember yeah, it was in the gym, yeah.

Chris:

Yeah, the hyperextension issue, yeah.

Reece:

So I had a back injury and a knee injury in 2022, which were pretty bad injuries for me and I still have some ongoing pains for them. But I'd bring it back down to why I'm here to race in the first place. It's just my. I feel like my mental strength is just there and my competitive nature is just there, and I come back stronger every time because it just fuels a fire that I just want to come back out on the track and just race. I'd say that's purely it.

Magnus:

We touched on with the last guest and it was this really deep inner belief. He's a very spiritual person, very connected to the inside. Do you feel a little bit of that as well with yourself, that the way that you are and that level of competitiveness is really coming from deep inside of just who you are as a person?

Reece:

I haven't really thought about it that way. I could definitely see it. I'd probably have to go home and digest it a little bit and just see where this competitive nature comes from.

Magnus:

But it's just always been the case. It's got to be coming from inside.

Don:

You need a heart to become a 400-meter runner right Exactly when you hit the last 50 meters. It doesn't matter how much technique and everything you've taught, If you don't have heart, that last 50 metres is all you.

Reece:

Okay, it could be the difference between first or last.

Magnus:

Yeah, 100%. So you mentioned that injury back knee. What's been the most significant setback that you've had so far in your career?

Reece:

I would say they're probably all equal. To be honest, yeah, a few hamstrings in the knee and the back, I'd say none of them were worse than any of the others.

Chris:

It's more that they're all equal because not not to answer for you, but because each time that he was sort of getting momentum to do something again. So like 2020 don't travel, okay. Pick yourself up, requalify. Don't travel, okay, I'm going to get ready. Okay, pick yourself up, requalify. Don't travel, okay, I'm going to get ready. 2022, oregon World Champs gets injured. It hurts his back Okay, next year. 2023, world Unis oh, I actually get to go to Europe. This time he actually gets unleashed on Europe and gets to run somewhere else. That's not.

Don:

Australia. I want to dig a little bit deeper into this, but I think we're going to need another episode because one of the things you talk about the injuries and and the fact that, like you know, you weren't answering for him but you're probably more qualified to answer on his behalf because I think there's a big correlation between the injuries, the recoveries, to be able to come back and run the second fastest time in my opinion, probably the fastest time if you didn't stop halfway through the race, not halfway 75%. I think it has a lot to do with your way of training. I think there's a new, there's a huge resurgent around this. There's a lot of data available and there's a huge quantum shift coming in how training is done. And there's a huge quantum shift coming in how training is done and it's been led by very few people. That understands how to interpret some of this data. And I want to tap into that a little bit more and understand your coaching methodologies. And also the other part is having that medical background that makes you understand the human anatomy a little bit more deeper than an average person.

Don:

I've got a maths degree, but this guy is probably one of the best analytical minds I've ever met. I wouldn't challenge him on trying to make sense of data. That's how crazy it is. I want to dip into it. If you're up to it, I'd love to get you guys back again and sit down and go deep into it. I think we're going to run out of time for this session, but you've got a few quickfire questions.

Magnus:

The fastest time over 400 metres. Where were you? Paris? One thing every day to keep you sharp Practice discipline, Favourite recovery tool or method that you use.

Reece:

I reckon recovery boots for sure.

Magnus:

I'll have to throw this one at Rhys again Worst training session you've ever had.

Reece:

Anything over 400 metres, Actually anything over 320 metres.

Magnus:

Would you agree that is worst training session.

Chris:

Yeah, probably from the carry-on yeah.

Don:

The 500s he hasn't done in a while.

Chris:

He doesn't make 500s. Yeah, no.

Don:

We did do 500s. You were there when we did the 500s Once, once, yeah.

Magnus:

What's your go-to hype song before a race?

Reece:

Oh, probably a bit of trap. Definitely trap. At the moment, no go-to song, just a. You know a set playlist. I think every athlete has a set playlist.

Magnus:

Chris, what's your biggest influence in life outside of sport?

Chris:

Being well-read, because I think if you read from a variety of sources, you can draw on them from different perspectives to solve problems.

Magnus:

Well said. And, rhys, if you weren't an elite athlete, what would you be doing?

Reece:

That's a good question, Probably just vibing out living life.

Don:

I love your honesty and chris.

Magnus:

What's the hardest part about being involved in performance sport?

Chris:

uh, when results go not the way you think, so poor performances, even though you may have prepared to your best your guilty pleasure.

Magnus:

Pleasure, food Rhys.

Reece:

Oh, pastries, I love pastries.

Don:

Mate, Paris would have been heaven.

Reece:

I was there after I was into everything.

Magnus:

One belief or quote that you live by, Chris Probably discipline equals freedom.

Don:

Hold on. I want to ask Rhys, Do you have a quote? I wouldn't say I'm too much in the quote space.

Reece:

Keep wiping, keep wiping. I wouldn't say I'm too much in the quote space.

Magnus:

Keep vibing. What do you say to yourself on days where you don't feel like training?

Reece:

I just look at the result of what I want to get out of each year. It's normally a major champs or like a time or something I want to run and just remind myself that I need to do this to get to where I want to get to and every day sort of counts. So there's those little one percenters.

Magnus:

And Chris, what's a trait every athlete must possess to be successful?

Chris:

Belief and hunger. I don't think you can have one without the other.

Magnus:

Fantastic having you guys in the studio this afternoon. Thank you very much for your time and insights and mate all the very best in up and coming competition. Thank you very much Thanks.

Reece:

time and insights and mate, all the very best in up and coming competition.

Don:

Thank you very much Thanks for having us. Thanks, mate, yeah.

Magnus:

Hope you enjoyed this exciting episode of the Mastering Podcast. If you got value from today's conversation, hit that subscribe button now and share this episode with a friend. Until next time.