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The Mastering Podcast
In a world obsessed with instant gratification and overnight success, Mastering… offers a refreshing antidote. We go beyond the surface-level stories and delve into the nitty-gritty of what it truly takes to master a craft.
Mastering is a podcast that delves into the secrets of mastery by interviewing experts at the top of their game. Each episode features an in-depth conversation with a master from a different field, from artists and athletes to entrepreneurs and scientists. We'll explore their journeys, their mindsets, and the unique skills and strategies they've developed to achieve excellence.
The Mastering Podcast
Lynnsanity Unleashed: From Cricket Pitch to Purposeful Leadership | Australian Cricket Powerhouse Chris Lynn
The smashing sound of cricket balls flying over boundaries may have made Chris Lynn famous, but it's his journey beyond the cricket pitch that reveals his most impressive talents. In this captivating conversation, the explosive Australian batsman opens up about transforming from a rugby league prospect to one of cricket's most feared T20 batsmen—despite multiple career-threatening shoulder reconstructions.
Lynn pulls back the curtain on the mental game that elite athletes must master, sharing how visualization techniques and proper breathing helped him maintain confidence through performance slumps. "If I miss out, don't get itchy feet," he explains about his batting mindset. "I say I'm not out of form – I'm one game closer to the man of the match." This perspective has enabled him to remain one of cricket's premier power hitters while balancing family life and business ventures.
Chris Lynn shares his transformative journey from elite T20 cricketer to purposeful leader as the founder of Playbook Coach, a platform connecting athletes with quality coaching across 32 different sports.
• Evolution from Test cricket aspirations to becoming a T20 powerhouse due to injuries and attraction to the shorter format
• Mental resilience strategies including visualization, breathing techniques, and positive framing of performance slumps
• The physical toll of multiple shoulder reconstructions that forced adaptation in his playing style
• Insights into global T20 franchise cricket and predictions about cricket's future in America
• Creation of Playbook Coach as a way to democratize access to quality sports coaching
• Challenges of transitioning from professional athlete to entrepreneur while still competing at an elite level
• The importance of balancing a cricket career with family life and business ventures
The conversation shifts from cricket fields to entrepreneurial pitches as Lynn reveals the story behind Playbook Coach, his platform connecting aspiring athletes with quality coaching across 32 different sports. "It's like Uber for sports coaches," Lynn explains, driven by his passion to provide others with the mentoring opportunities that shaped his career. The platform addresses a critical gap in sports development while helping athletes transition beyond their playing days.
Whether discussing the evolution of cricket, breaking down the art of hitting sixes, or sharing insights about entrepreneurship, Lynn brings the same explosive energy to conversation that cricket fans worldwide have witnessed on the field. Join us for this fascinating exploration of athletic excellence, purposeful leadership, and giving back to the sports that shape us. Ready to master your own game? This episode delivers the coaching you need.
Check out Playbook Coach to find quality coaching in your area or to offer your expertise to the next generation of athletes.
Want more? Find us on You Tube, Instagram, X, and TikTok where we share bonus content and engage with our listeners.
Don’t forget to subscribe, share, and leave a review! Your support helps us bring more inspiring stories to life. ❤️
First time he got me out first ball. Second time he got me out second ball, I was like shit, I better work out this sweep shot. Third time I faced him, his head was still on the big screen. It went bang straight between the eyes. We're built different here. But then when he bowled a top spinner you thought it was going to hit you in the full and it'd just drop. I was like this guy's an absolute genius. When I grew up, when you guys grew up, you were footy. You're bowling three balls down the street. Where is that now? I was pretty pissed off. But you know, you got to live by the sword. You got to die by the sword as well america.
Magnus:Is that where the the growth is going to be in the game in the next 10 years?
Don:yeah, how did you become this crazy? Tier 20 freak show growing up in the backyard.
Chris:That's. All you want to do is hit fours and sixes. No one was in the backyard, just trying to block out, right.
Magnus:Holy shit, holy Right. Today on the Mastering Podcast, we're joined by someone who's not only smashed sixes on the cricket ground around the world, but also now hitting new heights in coaching and leadership. Chris Lynn is an elite Australian cricketer known for his explosive batting and global impact in T20 leagues. But off the field he's also the founder of Playbook Coach, a platform helping the next generation of athletes develop the mindset, habits and game plans needed for success in sport and in life, with thrill to dive into his journey from professional sport to purposeful leadership. Welcome to the Mastering Podcast. I'm the host, magnus Olsson, and joining me today I've got my favourite co-host, don Sanker and Lucas Medecroft. Welcome to the podcast, boys.
Lucas:Yes, mate, looking forward to this one yeah.
Magnus:We have an absolute cracker guest today, Mr Chris Lynn. Welcome mate. Cheers mate, Looking forward to this one. Yeah, we have an absolute cracker guest today, Mr Chris Lynn, Welcome mate.
Chris:Thanks, mate.
Magnus:Thanks for those warm introductions. So you've mastered the short form of cricket, but off the field, what have you had to unlearn in order to evolve as a person?
Chris:Tough one straight off the bat no, honestly, I think. Tough one straight off the bat no, honestly, I think. Obviously, being a professional athlete since I was 19, I feel that I'm closer towards the end than the start, obviously trying to put someone else first and I've found since having my daughter she's two and a half now you've got to put her, you've got to put your missus first. I actually really struggle with that. So, to relearn, put someone else first rather than just concentrate on christling the cricketer. Put other people first because most important people in your life they should come first before a game of cricket in my life. So just relearning that and, yeah, just trying to be a good person away from the game.
Don:Talking about christling the cricketer. This is called mastering right, and you're the master of what we call the new age cricket. When I was growing up, we didn't even like the one day cricket and it became very popular, like if you weren't playing Tess, then you're not a cricketer, right. And then the evolution happened. So tell us a bit about you know. How did you get started? How did you become this crazy T20 freak show? That's like hitting sixes everywhere.
Chris:Yeah, I suppose it starts with.
Chris:Everyone wants to dream of the baggy green, right? So my dream was to play Test Cricket. But just the nature of you know, a couple of injuries and then the pathway that T20 has given me and a lot of people around the world like the franchise cricket, that was just so much more appealing to me. The appeal of fielding for five days wasn't there for me. I lost that interest. I wanted to whack the ball over the fence Growing up in the backyard. That's all you want to do is hit fours and sixes. No one was in the backyard just trying to block out. I just thought that's why I'm playing the game Like rugby league. I wanted to kick goals. You know, I wanted to be that guy.
Chris:Every ball that I tried to hit whether it's at the driving range, whether you've got a baseball bat in your hand or a cricket bat, you're trying to hit the thing. You're trying to hit the cover off the ball. And I found you know playing other sports. That and I found you know playing other sports. That definitely helped me with my power aspect of the game. But that's what brought me the most fun trying to whack the ball, and no matter how big and how tall and how fast they were, I could still smack them straight back over the head. So that's yeah. In a nutshell, that's how I got to T20 cricket and T10. Now you know. You said before.
Don:Is that good to T10?
Chris:Work smarter, not harder mate.
Don:I've been living under a rock. I'm still stuck in T20.
Chris:Yeah, well, like back in your day, you guys were scoring T20 in a one-day game, right, the IPL. Just recently they're scoring 270, 280 in a T20. Wow yeah, travis Head's, sunrisers Hyderabad, they're absolutely smoking it. Even last night there was a 240 score.
Magnus:you know, and the game never goes backward in any industry, in any work industry has the pitches changed a bit, though, for the batsmen to be so competitive?
Chris:Yeah, that's what I was going to ask. Are they smaller? I don't think so. I just think the guys are. You know we talk about growing up and you know everyone goes to the gym, everyone's got a program. The world never goes backwards, whether it's strength and conditioning, sports, science and life, and I think the batsmen are just getting so much better, bigger, stronger. The quality of the willow is better.
Lucas:Do you think they're being untaught how to block a ball now?
Chris:Well, you don't teach a kid, I believe, how to block the ball. You just teach to tell the kid hit the ball that way, hit the ball that way, and he will find out and work out his own way or method to hit the ball there. For me it might be a late cut. For McLean Maxwell it's a reverse sweep to hit the ball in the same area. So you give them that directive and then they just work it out themselves. And the best in the world do that and they do that. They adapt in every condition.
Chris:Obviously, in India the ball doesn't bounce as high, so you've got to find a way there. In Australia, the ball comes through here a lot more with the bounce, so you've got to again adapt to that. And, as I said, you don't tell them how to do this, because they'll work that out. Cricket is a batter and this is what I drill into as a coach. You're out there to score runs, not survive. The best form of defense is offense and that's the soul of cricket that I played and I got drilled into that from Brendan McCullum, darren Lehman yes, we are sportsmen, but we're entertainers. What better way to play the game than entertain and have fun?
Lucas:Do you think that's why, when you mentioned that first thing, around your family, it's hard to um, you know, just disintegrate or go the opposite direction of what you used to think about? Because it's a team sport. It always has been a team sport, but very much it's a me sport as well, and and I have to be the best, because I'm out there and I've got to hit these sixes nonstop to be the best, but I know I'm still part of the team, but it's still about me and then trying to like remove yourself and go. Actually, this is my family and put my family first. Is that why it's hard to transition?
Chris:And the older I get, like I always got disappointed if, say, we won, but I only scored 10 runs. But now I'm the other way. If we won, but I only scored 10 runs. But now I'm the other way If we won and I only got 10, I'm totally cool with that because you know I tried to play my role. It didn't work out, but at the end of the day the team won. So that aspect changes for me.
Chris:And then you move to the family life. I could have a shit day, but as long as you walk in the house and there's a big smile and a big hug in the house and there's a big smile and a big hug, that's a win, right? So everything, once you zoom out and I like to call it the helicopter view you know you zoom out, you can oversee everything. You take the emotion out of it. That's what has made me realize you know what's life about. Obviously, results are good, entertaining is fun. But, as I said, you zoom out, look at that big picture. You know you might just have a 1% win in a day. Those 1%s don't look like a lot, but a bit like when you're flying a plane. If we're going to Townsville from Brisbane and then you might end up in Darwin because you're 1% out and they all add up. But when you're in the moment it doesn't feel like much. But at the end of the day you're going in a different direction slowly. So those key points are important.
Don:To what he said, like the long-form game to me felt like a team sport, whereas the short-form game seems like an individual sport. It's just like the you know?
Lucas:Yeah, a little bit, especially contracts coming from life. Yeah, that's right.
Chris:I suppose you're relying on bigger individual performances in the shorter format, like the. I suppose you're relying on bigger individual performances in the shorter format, like the top. Four or five batters are out there to go bang, bang, bang and you don't want to change your plan A. You want to still be aggressive. If you lost two quick wickets, because it only takes your plan A to come off and you'd like to think, out of five batters, one of them will come off and then you win. But the biggest thing is, as a batter, if I miss out, don't get itchy feet. If I miss out again on a score, I go two, three, five. I'm actually I say I'm not out of form One game closer than me in the match. It's my turn coming, and so that's the way I like to look at things, rather than that half-glass empty type attitude.
Chris:Do you even think about how many ducks you got? All the time? You could go 100, 100, 100, but if you get a duck and then you're walking out there the next game, you're like, oh mate, what's going on? All that work, all that like bravado, your chest is out for those innings, but then you get a ball, or you smoke one down a deep, long fence and you're out. It's so humbling, so grounding. But that's the nature of the beast.
Magnus:You mentioned a lot about the physicality of the sport now and people are training so much harder and they're getting bigger, they're getting stronger. What about mentally? Is there something that sets apart the elite players? Do you think mentally?
Chris:Yeah, definitely, and that's what I just touched on about. If I do miss out, my mentality is I'm one game closer to the man of the match, because you can quite easily well just take the Big Bash, for example. There's 10 games in the regular season. I'd like to think I'm going to win two games off my own bat, so I could miss out first. Eight games a year. I'll still be confident. I'm going to go bang, bang and the top four if they win two games each off your own bat. Eight wins, that's, you're in the semis. You've probably finished in the top. So that's the way I think about it. And as a professional panic last First one who panics generally is a team that fumbles first and then. Players are too good, teams are too good to jump on that.
Magnus:We had Phil Jauncey in here the other week and he's a renowned performance psychologist. Do you have your own personal one or the team's? How big is that in the sport today?
Chris:Well, for me personally it's massive Ever since COVID. So during COVID I did like four months hard quarantine in total, two weeks at a time in that two and a half years. So I was in a bit of a headspace going what, what's going on?
Magnus:were you stuck on the other side of the planet?
Chris:other side of the planet. But, like even in the hotel room, I come back here. Like you just walk around in circles, listen to podcasts. So you went home, you went at home. I did one two weeks in at home. Um, actually I got caught on a golf course really wasn't an idea be yeah, but yeah.
Chris:so I invested in myself with a with a sports psych who actually, you know, grew up in Ipswich and he lives on the south side here now, so he works with some big names and you know it's, it's funny because you've got team sports psychs, right but I'm not a big believer in them because they get you know, you tell them your weaknesses away, whatnot.
Chris:Who does he report to their coach? Prerogative goes to yeah, so I'm like I wasn't. I wasn't, um comfortable with that. So I found, if I outsource my own sports, psych or train or whatever it may be, that just really helped me. And you know little things like journaling. Um, every day, you know breakfast, lunch, dinner, um, just, and then you can download basically what's going on in your brain. If you do have a bit of fog there, you download it, you move on and um, just keeping things really simple. Um, no need to reinvent the wheel, understanding that it is just a game that we play and bringing everything back and if you're having a shit day, actually having a shit day, yeah.
Chris:Or you're just carrying on a bit.
Magnus:What about visualisation? Are you a big one on looking at that?
Chris:Night before a game. Yeah, yep, obviously, in the world we live in now the footage that's out there. I can download data with bowlers and whatnot. But I just like to lay in bed, just chill out and you know he's going to bowl at you generally with all the information that you get and you just repeat sort of your success you've had against that certain bowler or a weakness, if he's got you out and how you're going to combat, you know, hopefully throw the first punch. But visualization is big because I believe when you get to that moment you've already seen it and then you can just take a step back. Deep breath.
Don:We've had a couple of Olympic athletes and Phil Jones last week and one of the biggest things is the importance of having that support, having that performance coaching or the mental health support. Yeah, one of the biggest issues. I find it's so hard to find one right Like how do you go about? How did you get yours? Like, how does an individual athlete at any level find that support?
Chris:Mine was just through a really good mate of mine. He said he actually works with. You know, he worked with Red Bull and he now works with Lance Stroll. So some big athletes and it's not cheap. But, as I said, when you invest in yourself, I don't think there's a price limit on that. Without this bloke I don't reckon I'd be sitting here today. It could have been retired, could have been wherever. So, as I said, when you invest in yourself, that's priceless. And the big thing about a firm of sports likes they don't go out and advertise, because that's not their brand, because they don't need that If they're going to preach something.
Chris:Especially the good ones right, that's right. I believe the good ones. They're a ghost. You can't find them online. That's why I was asking the question. Yeah, like it's actually really cool because if they're going to be out there on billboards and whatnot, I think they're preaching the wrong or teaching the wrong thing to their clients.
Lucas:So word of mouth is the only way you can find these people. Word of mouth, basically.
Don:We're going to get to Playbook Coach, you know soon, but I think there's a good opportunity there, right, like it's Absolutely, absolutely.
Chris:I mean the biggest thing you know for Playbook. When I grew up, when you guys grew up, you were in the backyard kicking the footy.
Don:Yeah.
Chris:You're bowling. You're cribbing down the street. Where is that now? You know we're giving kids opportunity to yes, it is an app, so a little bit contradictive, but let's keep kids in sport. You know the numbers are dropping, everyone's behind PlayStation now. Playstation and it's amazing, like I said with my little one, she knows how to work my phone. She's two and a half, so we're kids, like what the hell has that happened.
Lucas:That's frightening. We had Atari. Yeah, that's right.
Don:I had those things that you put the discs in, not the discs, the cassettes in?
Chris:Yeah, that's right, but where's the ball on the string type, the racquetball? That's it, you know, the ball in the stocking. It's nowhere to be seen now, which is a little bit disturbing.
Don:I still remember going into I don't know if you've played cricket in Sri Lanka to Mount Lavinia Beach, and one morning the West Indies cricket team was actually playing beach cricket, there I played cricket with the West Indies cricket team.
Lucas:That's the best in the world as well.
Magnus:I sent Linny a photo of myself last week playing cricket on the street back when I was growing up, asking him for some form tips and it's probably one of the reasons I'm sitting here doing this and not part of the T20. But it just brought back those memories and now, when you drive around on the street, I can't remember the last time I saw kids out playing on the street and that was what we did every afternoon.
Chris:That's right until the streetlights come on. That was the rules right, be home when the lights come on. Yeah for me.
Don:I was at the beach. I was there first thing in the morning, go training and then yeah.
Chris:It's getting fewer and further between seeing that, which is disappointing. But you know, the Australian culture is very sport-driven, right, you've got the rich history, so, yeah, that's one thing I'm passionate about is giving back to the community, to the grassroots, where it all started.
Lucas:For me, Is this how Playbook started? Yeah, basically.
Don:Before we get to Playbook like I want to get there.
Lucas:I want to see the evolution though.
Don:Tell us a bit about Chris Lynn, the young aspiring athlete Like how did you become Chris Lynn the cricketer? Yeah, well as I touched on, I was rugby league first right.
Chris:So I played my juniors at North Devils Rugby League. My first coach was Tommy Bishop, who's an England great. What position did you play in the league? I was a halfback Halfback. Yes, I played schoolboys.
Don:How old was this Before Little Athletics or before? Yeah, when you're seven Everyone seems to go through Little Athletics when you're seven or eight.
Chris:I didn't do Little Athletics, I only got short legs so it wasn thing. But yeah, play was fortunate to play schoolboys. Uh, rugby league with benny hunn, andrew mcculloch and james o'connor who played here for the wallabies. And um, yeah, as I touched on earlier, I believe I can hit the ball harder through cross code training. Um, you know, most people max out in the gym every six to eight weeks. You're right, when you play footy, rugby league, rugby, you're tackling 200 times a week. You're maxing out 200 times a week. And you see, the league boys, their chests are out here. They're stronger, they've got big ass from that ground up strength training and that's why I reckon I can hit the ball harder than a lot of other cricketers so yeah, that was my background growing up.
Chris:Dad played waterpile for Australia so I was basically forced to. I was thrown in the pool, sink or swim type attitude and I don't regret him throwing me in the pool at all because one it's a life skill and swimming your core strength and the fitness that you get out of it. It's a lot easier on your body, on your joints and whatnot. And then through the grades, you know 15, 16, you make rep teams and basically I was getting to grade 11, grade 12, and I was just scared to go into the workforce, scared to walk into uni. I remember mum bought me a $5,000 uni package. I can't even remember what it was called, some sport, whatever it was called. I read one page, I worked out how to pay mum five grand and said don't let me do this again. Basically I'll stick to hitting cricket balls, and away it went.
Don:So when did you realise that's what you're good at? Like back home in Sri Lanka, you're born and you're given a ball and a bat.
Lucas:Yeah, it's a religion for you.
Don:Yeah, you're given a ball and a bat if you can't make it I suppose you do the representative stuff and then there's opportunities.
Chris:I went to England so straight out of school, played in England, played club cricket over there for six months and come back and got my first contract. So I worked in a car yard. I was a dish pig for a couple of months, a couple of weeks here and there and yeah, as I said, that thought of going into the workforce scared the shit out of me and then I put the head down and I always knew I had the talent, but I didn't know what that looked like in the modern game of cricket back then when I was 19.
Lucas:So do you think the fear was driving you more? I really don't want to go into the corporate world A little bit Plus.
Chris:You do. You look up to your Haydens, your Langers, your Steve Walsh, your Ricky Pontings, your Brett Lees, glenn McGrath, shane Warne. That era of cricket was like holy shit. They're good Like the best in the world. So every day in the backyard I was very fortunate. My old man built a cricket net down the side of my house as well, of his house.
Lucas:You just gave me goosebumps, because I remember literally lying on the couch for days upon days watching the test cricket, which doesn't happen anymore, but that's what we did when we were young.
Chris:Gabba test, first test, that was one of the best days of the year. And he rolls into the Boxing Day test. And now, because there's so much cricket, you'd be like, oh, if I miss tonight I think we love the strategy as well.
Don:There's always this strategic, Like some of the captains you just look at what they're doing it was just like absolutely amazing, right it?
Lucas:was McGrath, mcgrath, just strategic on. What am I going to do in this test and this game and the handballing?
Magnus:Warnie was like that too.
Chris:A quick fun fact about Glenn McGrath he can name every wicket that he took. He took 500 or 600 wickets. He can name exactly what like if you asked him 122.
Magnus:Rainman.
Lucas:Yeah, wow, crazy, we'll bring him on and put him to the test.
Chris:Pretty impressive. Yeah, he's now a Queenslander. Clay McGrath lives up on the Sunshine Coast, the great man, Do you think the long-form game is done?
Don:it's gone.
Chris:No, not at all. Not at all. I think the one-day game is gone, I think. I personally think international T20 cricket won't last, because franchise cricket will take over and then they'll just bring in the World Cup.
Magnus:Maybe just elaborate on that. What's franchise? Cricket will take over and then they'll just bring in the world cup. Maybe just just elaborate on that.
Chris:What's franchise cricket? Franchise cricket so it's an option I took, basically so you get to play t20 cricket t10 cricket around the world um, for example, the ipl teams like mumbai and kolkata own teams in um dubai, in the caribbean and now in england.
Don:So yeah, in the us.
Chris:It's basically in the US, yeah, and there's private ownerships. There's a lot of people that love cricket that we don't know about. Yes, obviously India is the backer, but in America there's so much money and so much love for the game and cricket.
Lucas:This is because regular outsider sports are investing into the sport, because they see the opportunity from an investment perspective.
Chris:Absolutely, especially in like. Again, I got to be able to play cricket in Canada and the fields there they can't fill the baseball fields, but they're screaming out more cricket fields. It's amazing. So that's the growth in the game and people from a business point of view. Who doesn't love growth in business?
Don:Yeah, you don't want to lose those stories with you know, you look at the Donald Bradman wearing the baggy green. That's aspiration, that's what brings kids into the game.
Chris:Yeah, I don't think Test Cricket will ever die, but I'd just like to see the. I don't want to see the model of Test Cricket change. We're seeing guys like Sam Constance come in all these reverse swipes and yeah, that looks good for 15 minutes, but is there a longevity in that? Like the Baz Ball in England, they're going out, they're scoring 400 or 500 in a day. Is there longevity in that? Look, I hope so, because it's entertaining and guys and females and kids that don't have the attention span or the love for cricket. We're about introducing new faces to the game, so I just don't want it to be this little flashbang.
Don:I don't know about you. I love the way Tendulkar or Brian Lara played, like they took their time.
Chris:There was strategy in the game. They invested into the game. Correct, you could see Guys like Usman Khawaja are still that old school. Yeah, there's roles for that.
Lucas:I will say, though, based on, like that, I guess, the long form disappearing. I hadn't watched Test Cricket properly in a very long time, but this last Christmas test was insanely epic. It absolutely was glued to my screen. Yeah, that's right. Maybe you can elaborate on this. Whatever happened to make that again, that feeling that I had 20 years ago was awesome.
Chris:I think a bit of rivalry Australia and India. Virat Kohli's got a bit of mongrel about him. We've got this new kid on the block that no one's seen and he's reversing the best bowler in the world for six in the second over test match. It's awesome, right, but you know you've got to live by the sword. You've got to die by the sword as well, so it's going to be extremely hard to be consistent in that space. Everyone loves consistency. Selectors love consistency. I'm not the most consistent batter, but, as I said, you've got to live by the sword, die by the sword, and when you do come off, it's box office.
Lucas:This is because they're bringing the T20 type of style into a test match. That's some of those variations throughout the series and that kind of makes it exciting.
Chris:Yeah, definitely, and the ebbs and flows. We've got day and night test cricket now, which is even better, I believe, because when you get to that twilight stage the ball gets a bit harder to see and the ball swings around corners and you know it's good viewing.
Don:I mean, I remember, when it was all changing, the controversy of the change in the colour of the ball.
Chris:That's right.
Don:People liked it. Half the people didn't like it. What?
Chris:I said right at the start we're cricketers but we're entertainers, and that entertaining business is paying more paying the players, so let's entertain.
Don:I think the old school way of looking at it, it's a gentleman's sport. We're not here to entertain, we're here to just. It's a strategy game, right? I grew up watching that strategy game where entertainment was. Even when there was entertainment, you would say oh.
Chris:Yeah, well, that's right. Like the incentive from the chairman of Queensland Cricket a few years ago was just to entertain, and like we were entertained but we were losing. I was like mate, well, let's just win, Win ugly. You know, all I care about is the trophies.
Magnus:Does that translate back into grassroots? So do you think the grassroots test cricket? Because, like you pointed out, it's great. I think the kids, the kids love going along to the T10, the T20 matches. But with that test cricket, do you think that it's still like schoolboy and at shield level it's still strong to be able to get it to continue?
Chris:I don't think it's as strong as what it once was, simply because we had a perfect example the other day with Usman Kouaja missing the game. If that was back in Alan Borda's day, or whatever, that wouldn't even have been an option. They would have been there from the last game, the next flight. If it was a club game, ab would have played. I know there's a lot more cricket now, but I feel like the emphasis on state cricket is not as high for the players coming back from Australia or the players coming back from Queensland to club cricket and vice versa.
Magnus:Speaking of Queensland state cricket. The boys didn't go too well today.
Chris:No, the boys have just been bundled out for 95, which is not ideal, but it is a five-day game. Yep, it could be. I have seen the wickets. It is nipping around a little bit. What I do know is the Queensland boys will fight. Yep, 100%. That's a Marine cap. You put that on, we will fight. We've got a great record against South Australia, so fingers crossed. But in saying that, one of my best mates, ryan Harris, is the South Australian cricket coach and I love the bloke, can't say what.
Chris:I've heard about him. They won the one day title already.
Don:So you know I wouldn't be too disappointed if he wins a Shield final, talking about Sheffield Shield, right, how did you go from someone who hits 200 runs in a Sheffield, one of the best in the T20, and then not in the test teams?
Chris:Yeah, so I had to do a double shoulder reconstruction basically and I'm left-handed, naturally left-handed and then had a double recon and then I taught myself to throw right-handed and then I'd tuck this one in. We're playing in New Zealand. I'd tuck this one in. I'd throw it right side out. When was this? I just taught myself to throw right-handed six, seven years ago and I was playing for Australia at the time and my shoulders were just busted.
Lucas:So a big thing for me is you can't bat too well without shoulders. Yeah, that's right.
Chris:A big thing for me is if I had a big day on the field or a big day batting, I couldn't lift my arm. So the most disappointing thing would be letting down your teammates playing days one and two and days three and four not being able to lift it up. So that played a big role and I knew in T20 cricket I could play for three hours, have a day off and get up again. And also that entertainment factor I love smacking the ball out of the park. There was one day where we lost one season where we lost the toss and fielded every day of the.
Chris:Sheffield Shield game and I was like, oh man, this sucks, when did you field? I was in the slips for a bit. I was a bit everywhere mid-on, mid-off point. Yeah, you field that many overs. You tend to go around the park a bit.
Magnus:But with your shoulders you weren't on the fence.
Chris:No, no, feel that many overs. You tend to go around the park a bit, but with your shoulders you weren't on the fence. No, no, not. Then I would just go short fine leg or whatever it may be. But what probably summed it up? I think I was on like 87, day two of sheffield shield game and I could have scored the easiest hundred because they had everyone on the fence. I thought, oh, this is three shots hundred and I got caught on the fence. They had everyone on the fence. I was like I think that's my time in this. I'm disrespecting the badge, I'm disrespecting the long form out of the game.
Don:I absolutely loved batting during or did the injury force you out of that?
Chris:from a parts of it parts of it, but my heart wasn't in it towards the back end psychologically.
Don:How did you deal with that and how did you adapt and make the decision? Okay, this is where I'm going to be, because lots of people would have either given up.
Chris:Yeah, I mean, I just always knew I could always drive more than I let through. Yeah, um, you know, and I struggle to dive now. So that's why I do hide field and it does hurt because you're so competitive and at training you're like I just feel it's short-funding.
Don:I don't need to do. Hold on Like for someone who hates fielding and all these problems. I've seen some of the catches you have made.
Chris:They're some of the best entertaining stuff. Yeah, I've got a couple of highlight packages, yeah.
Don:So what's the deal with that? Like you, put your body on the line.
Chris:I suppose I was just sick of like because that's how I had my double shoulder. It was fielding, it was diving, shoulder would pop out and I was actually like one the pain and two the rehab to go through it. That nearly killed me. Like you're sitting in there on a recliner you can't sleep, like if you cough, like you're in so much agony. So I just couldn't bear going through three to four shoulder recons. I thought I haven't had enough and I limit myself to what I can do in the field. There's a new rule now in T20 and T10 where there's an impact player, so the 20 over mark you can get subbed out and a bowler comes in. Greatest rule ever. Hope they bring it in the big dash. But yeah, it's just and that's why I'm saying it hurts me because you're so competitive at training. You want to be the best um, but then you get into slowly lazy habits when you can't feel it or do those little one percenters, so your batting is still not effective by it.
Chris:But yeah, but everything else batting was a little bit. I was actually batting with like a seat belt type shoulder um thing, a bit like um jonathan thurston had on when he was playing. So basically you could tighten the seat belt up and if I wanted to get to there I could get it, or if it was lower I'd make it tighter, um, just to make sure I had that nice stability in there.
Don:But, um, look, it's okay now, um yeah, I guess, like some of those catches, I'm going back to it because I saw there was one where I don't know which one that was. I think that's the one, abtv's one, yeah, so there was one.
Chris:It was my first game for the Kolkata Knight Riders and to go back even further, I got to bat with Jax.
Don:Cullors, that went crazy.
Chris:I remember that one, yeah, and then took this catch on the boundary and I slipped over because it was so dewy in Sharjah and it went in the lights. I was like, oh, this is my first and last game. And then I sort of jumped off my knees and held myself in from the boundary and that's sort of like one of those watch office moments, yeah, and sort of put you on the map a little bit as well.
Chris:But yeah, they're those moments you look back on and you go that's pretty cool. How the hell did I do that type of thing?
Lucas:You just ignored that you're going to have pain. When you landed, You're like I'm going to ignore this pain and just go for it.
Chris:Yeah, that was before. I had one recon then, so I still thought I was able to. But after the third and fourth one I was like no, I'm not diving, it's too hard. If you haven't had a shoulder recon, you know that's curtains. That's sort of game over for me. But, fortunately enough, yeah, still in the park, still hungry and ever, and it's yeah for all you batters out there, don't hit it towards me Before we move on.
Lucas:How many seasons do you think you are aiming to go for? Because you know, back in the day it was like you get to 35 years old. That's essentially. That's an athlete right. Yeah, and then you have to transition to corporate, which you really don't want to go towards. What's that transition? Look like.
Chris:It changes every day. Honestly, some days I absolutely hate it, some days I absolutely love it. But the good days outweigh the bad days. I'm big on just signing my new deals, especially this point in my career, just because you never know what's around the corner. But it keeps me on my toes as well. It keeps me hungry and motivated. What I do love is these young guys coming through. Seeing Josh Brown, fraser McGurk it's like who's going to hit the most sixes out of those two? It's like come on, that's my challenge. It's like a hold my beer type thing. I'm gonna go hit more or double or whatever. So, um, the young, the younger boys keep you on your toes and you know, I feel like I've been a big part of the um, of the big bash, a decent blueprint of it. So I'm not going to give out my spot that easy because I've worked so hard to get where I've got to because you're the highest run scorer in the, in the, in the big bash, aren't you, yeah Over?
Chris:3,000? I'd like to keep extending that. I think I'm not too far off 4,000.
Don:You want to be the LeBron James of cricket right.
Chris:Yeah, I hope to be the better actually. But yeah, that, and I want to keep you know, smacking sixes and extending my lead there as well.
Don:Yeah, talking about sixes, how many sixes did you hit in a row? There was insane innings that you had.
Chris:I remember it but I can't remember it. Yeah, there was one game in the MCG. I hit five in a row and it was a bit of backstory. First of all, it was a freezing night in Melbourne. First of all, I actually kicked up off a length off Ben Hill for now. So I thought, shit, this is like this ball's got my number on it, like the pitch is playing up a little bit, and I just went bang and bang and I was like, well, I stop now, I'll keep going, but going back to you One of the biggest grams in the world.
Magnus:You decide to hit the most inches on it. That's what it is. Is it actually yeah?
Chris:That's going back to, like your muscle memory and what your sports like can help do it. It's a bit like Rafa Nadal he does the same movements whether it's in the first set or the fifth set. So that's one of the strengths that you can do. And talk about breathing, visualising. After every ball, I like to just take a nice deep breath. You know, away from the crease, a lot of people like to go down and tap the wicket, whereas I like to stand there and visualise around and you know, use my cricket IQ and your awareness where the ball's going and what the movements of the ball are doing. And again, you slow your heart rate down when you're in a decent place, when your heart rate's down, rather than your eyes spinning when you run out. So you've got that clarity. I was massive on that and I still am.
Magnus:Love that you prefer to face spin bowling or fast bowling.
Chris:Pace on, yeah, pace on. Sometimes you don't know which way the ball's going. The spinners now they've got fast arm actions, arm and legs are going everywhere. Rashid Khan's the best in the world. Sonny on the run. Murrilly, that game I took the catch against RCB. I faced Murrilly twice before that. First time he got me out, first ball. Second time he got me out, second ball, I was like shit, I better work out this sweep shot. And the first ball. The third time I faced him his head was still on the big screen. It went bang straight between the eyes and sort of rolled back to him in charge. It's all about playing the ball, not the man. You talk about that mental game in sport or whatever it may be. As a youngster, sometimes I played the player and his legacy rather than just the ball or what's in front of you.
Don:Are you talking about Moralee? Sri Lankan? Yeah, king, which side of the fence are you on, daryl Hay?
Chris:I knew this was coming. I knew this was coming. No, merle is a good friend, you can pass.
Lucas:No, you can't.
Chris:He's got a lot of test wickets. You know what it would be interesting now to see with a lot more players have been pulled up, pulled up for chucking. So with technology now it would just be interesting to see. I don't believe it's not an orthodox action, but he's got different flexibility in his wrist and his elbow.
Don:We did all the scans right there was x-rays.
Chris:There was everything. What was the?
Don:conclusion he wasn't a shark, he wasn't, he wasn't. That's why he's never worse in the world. His records still stand. He's shane one, really like it's uh.
Chris:But I tell you what, when he, when he bowled it, you could hear this like fizz coming down. It was like oh my god, which way is it going? And like I thought it was going that way. It was going that way, but you're trying to pick which way it's going left or right. But then when he bowled a top spinner, you thought it was going to like hit you on the full and it'd just drop. I was like this guy's an absolute genius. But yeah, just a great component of the game.
Magnus:I reckon it's really good for the game, though, isn't it Having a bit of controversy?
Don:High entertainment rivalry and, you know, got us. I think you need a bit of rivalry, right? If you want entertainment, there's always got to be a hero and a villain. Yeah, you know he was a villain.
Chris:And someone to challenge the big nations of cricket too, and you guys 1996.
Don:We keep going back to 1996.
Magnus:Long time ago I was six years old, way too long.
Don:It is way too long. We'll be back. We'll be back. You're an Aussie now, bro, yeah, but I was born in Sri Lanka, mate, so, yeah, that blood still runs through.
Magnus:And how are they going? The mighty Sri Lankan cricket team, are they going to go, okay, this year?
Don:So, chris, we're talking about mighty Sri Lankans are making their way back.
Chris:Beautiful country, Sri Lanka. I absolutely love it. It is.
Don:It is a beautiful place. So, mate, so what made you so? You gave up first class and decided to stick with franchise cricket right. Mainly, how did you? Why did you do that?
Chris:What was the Obviously the body, what we just touched on. That was a big factor. But a big thing for me is making that decision and make sure you stick with it, because if you have a runabouts in two or three tournaments in a row and then you go back to Sheffield Shield or one day cricket for Queensland, people will just see right through you. So that's one thing I am proud of is just sticking with my decision and not touring anding back and forth again because you just lose your authenticity. I believe and I feel like I could make a really good trademark in T20 cricket and the opportunities now in franchise cricket is ridiculous. It was just fun. You travel around the world trying to hit sixes.
Don:Tell us a bit about the franchise. I think you've played in almost every franchise. Every single one of them.
Chris:I've played in nearly every tournament around the world.
Lucas:Yeah, any favourites.
Chris:Look, everyone's got their pros and cons. You're playing in the Caribbean Premier League. You've got Trinidad, barbados some of the best beaches in the world. Best golf courses in the world. You some of the best beaches in the world, best golf courses in the world.
Lucas:You've got India we're talking about cricket right. Yeah, we just love travelling to these places.
Chris:For three hours. What do you reckon you do on the other 21 hours of the day? That's it. But now we're going to places like Dallas, toronto, cayman Islands in May coming up. These places are where we want to grow the game. You don't need to evolve, india's obviously there. But you don't need to grow the game. It's already naturally, organically grows because they're the powerhouse. So our job now is, and my job's always been, to grow the game and bring these new faces into the sport. England's massive. You know a good day in London, pretty special. The only place I haven't played cricket is actually South Africa.
Don:Yeah, wow, interesting um. The only place I haven't played cricket is actually south africa.
Chris:Yeah, wow, interesting. So you've never went on a rugby tour there for school, but never played cricket there? Um, I've been to new zealand once and that's on our doorstep. Um, yeah, it's, uh, it's. It's some lonely times as well.
Don:It's not just bells and whistles, because I was gonna ask how does that affect your personal life and also your family life?
Chris:yeah, so the family will come over at the odd tournament. But you're on the other side of the world. If you're in the Caribbean and by the time your family gets there like halfway through the tournament, it's not fair on them. But you're there for a job. You have a bit of fun along the way. If they can come, that's great. If not, you're just pretty lucky with Zoom and FaceTime and try and utilise that. It is a bit tough to get up in the morning or remember to FaceTime at night or stay up later with the time differences, but that's the way it goes.
Magnus:Do you think America? Is that where the growth is going to be in the game in the next 10 years?
Chris:A hundred percent yeah, I mean, I don't think it'll actually catch baseball, but as we spoke about a lot of money that's in America, who wouldn't want to go to America? Right, you know the way they do sport, it's just next level. I was fortunate to go to LA and Vegas last year and the big mash is trying to emulate that with. It's not just about the product on the field, it's actually the fireworks, the music, the mascots, the hype it's entertainment.
Lucas:The hype.
Chris:Yeah, it's different and that's why you see in LeBron's contract he has to play unless he's injured. There's no resting players because people are coming from all around the globe to watch this entertainment, which is pretty cool. It's not cheap over there, but you get a beer here that's $15, $20 as well.
Lucas:Same same you mentioned before around as a kid, the transition with, like I say, a baseball bat and being able to hit the ball with a golf or playing golf. Because baseball is so big in the US, there's no reason there can't be a transition of those athletes, especially the junior athletes, coming and transitioning from baseball into cricket.
Chris:I think there will be at some point. But you know I've tried it and it's bloody hard. First of all, I've got my bat. That's your stance in cricket If you're getting a baseball thrown generally. Here, see, my bat is coming on an upwards angle. It's a bit like when you top a golf ball, top spin. It just top spins and goes nowhere. So you've actually got to get your hands up this high to coming down and meeting the ball.
Chris:So then it planes and the position from there to there is uncomfortable and there's a massive difference um. So yeah, that just that alone um is is a, yeah, very, very hard skill on itself.
Don:Telling an american to play cricket instead of uh yeah baseball.
Chris:That's a there's a huge cultural element there too that, and cricket is the hardest game to explain as well. It gives me the shits to explain it to people in America.
Don:I was talking to someone and they thought I was talking about a lighter. I didn't even know. There's a lighter called cricket. How do you?
Chris:catch without gloves, without a mitt.
Lucas:It's the same as the push with NRL into Vegas right, and they're like how can you run and carry a ball without any helmet, Without any?
Chris:helmets. Yeah, we do it. We're built different here.
Don:But the thing is, you don't need any of that. They know how well to do sport. You just bring any sport there.
Chris:That's right. They have the entertainment.
Magnus:Don't get me wrong said, but it's going to take a long, long time. One thing I do know to say when it's a basketball, or whether it's a baseball and I know the ice hockey is the same they'll play three or four games every week for 26 weeks. So the volume that they get in and there's games played on a Tuesday night or a Thursday night and they're a sellout and they're a sellout. Whereas you look here, the games that we have on, most of them are on a Friday night or a Saturday night, we have 24 million people there They've got 350-odd million people but do you think, and infrastructure built around to support that?
Don:Yeah, I think that's.
Magnus:But it supports T20 cricket, though, because you're able to play a game. Like you said, have a day of rest and then you'll play a game, definitely, and then you'll play a game, definitely, and that's what I said.
Don:Yeah, you take it to America, they've got that infrastructure, they've got the entertainment.
Magnus:I'll happily play three times a week for $50 million. What about the pitch? What do they do for a?
Don:pitch over there.
Chris:There's a couple of cricket stadiums that wickets are in. There's full-time groundsmen. I'm mates with one of them. He's from Adelaide.
Magnus:Mate, the facility is really really good.
Chris:So purpose-built cricket stadiums Purpose-built? Yeah, they had the World Cup there last year, didn't they? Yeah? Okay, so yeah, I thought they were just hybrid. They just put these up properly. No, they drop them in. Yeah, I played in a smaller tournament in Dallas of Texas University, like just a cool little ground. The wicket wasn't great, but it's going to take a couple of years for it to embed and flatten out properly. But they're just learning.
Lucas:Imagine a new sport.
Chris:Like you said, with rugby leagues. They've got no idea, so they'd be learning as well.
Lucas:But talk about Is India driving this? Where is this coming from to drive?
Don:into the US. It started with the.
Lucas:IPL right.
Chris:Yeah, india is definitely driving it, like the Mumbai Indians, kolkata Knight Riders. You think we've got a lot of Indians here. I think again, because they've got 350 million people over there, so naturally scalable, massive numbers. But people in America love betting too.
Lucas:Yeah, I was going to say that's the other side and they can bet on anything.
Chris:So if there's ball by ball, like baseball, you can bet on anything that's going to attract numbers.
Don:Yeah, cricket's got a lot of elements you can bet on. So, going back to the Mumbai Indians you were talking about, I saw in the statistics you played one game.
Chris:One game, that was it. Well, quinton, the cock didn't arrive or was in COVID quarantine, so I got the nod and I got 49, but I ran out. Rohit Sharma, I was like hmm, I need to get 150 here. I ran out the skipper and didn't play again, simple.
Don:Oh, it's good.
Magnus:That's a story I tell, but Quinton Cock was coming back in anyway.
Chris:Yeah, okay, the nature of Mumbai Indians is generally they're pretty good. Which year?
Don:was that.
Chris:I'm going to say four or five years ago. Okay yeah, five years ago now. Great franchise, one of the most professional franchises. You know we'd win games and you'd end up with iPads on your bed, type thing, and not short of wealth the Mbani family, but a great family and yeah, very successful.
Don:How do you manage the IPL? And were you playing Big Bash at the same time?
Chris:Yeah, yeah, yeah, the IPL is this time of year. It's in April. March, April and then Big Bash is not until December. I go from the Big Bash basically finish the Sheffield Shield season or whatever cricket I was playing and then roll into IPL.
Magnus:Are you in IPL this year again?
Chris:No IPL. I actually haven't been involved the last three to four years, I reckon, and you know as an overseas player, there's eight slots but only four get to play. Generally you've got to do two things bat, bowl, yeah so I only really do one dimensions, but I've had 10 years of the IPL, so I'm really grateful for that.
Don:Mate, you became a superstar with one catch, yeah.
Chris:Kolkata Knight Riders played. I was six years at Colcutta and played probably 30 40 games there and had a good record and had some fun. I remember one game with Sonny when we were on. We opened the batting in Bangalore and we ended up 104 off the power play, off the six overs and we were like we had so much fun and won a title with them, won a title with Mumbai Mate. It's been awesome. Wolf picked me up for 20 grand when I was 20 years old for the deck and charges. You know that's where my journey started. The IPO.
Chris:Oh yeah you had one season with him. Yeah, he and I was Kumar Sangakkara, Cameron White, Dale Stain, JP Dillman here.
Lucas:What an investment. Yeah, it's a good opportunity. It was awesome.
Chris:Tell me a lot. I was like it wasn't about that, it was about being a sponge around. You know the greats of the game 2018, 2019,.
Don:right, you were probably the best like best record, probably, or was. Well, you were right. You had the leading score, most amount of sixes yeah, but didn't make the World Cup team.
Chris:Yeah, yeah, it was a bit of a. I was pretty pissed off. I think the World Cup was in Bangladesh or India, maybe I can't remember. But yeah, I was only I was pretty new on the scene then but I thought I did enough. But they went down. I'm going to say they went down to Brad Hodge, the older option just because it was in the subcontinent and I didn't really. I'm not sure if I went down to Brad Hodge, the older option just because it was in the subcontinent and I didn't really. I'm not sure if I dominated in the IPL then.
Don:You did dominate the Big Bash, right yeah.
Chris:I can't remember the timeline, but I think it was just where the location was, because cricket in the Big Bash in Australia is vastly different to IPL cricket in India or in the Caribbean on different wickets. So I think they just went for an experience number, which I'm okay with.
Lucas:Which I guess these days, with technology and data and statistics, we'll be able to, like you know, pull that data together on different pitches, different locations and go who's the best player in that particular situation?
Chris:Yeah, definitely definitely, and it's quite interesting when you go to like the IPL auction situation. Yeah, definitely, definitely, and it's quite interesting when you go to like the IPL auction, they'll pick guys from the big base that have never played in India and they better go for big money. Then they get to India and they're like they struggle. It's quite. It's hard to watch.
Don:And that six. I knew that was coming. What went?
Chris:through your head and Well, it's a wild thing, right, they call it a wild thing for a reason. He doesn't exactly know where they're going, so how am I supposed to know? But big Sean Tatey's steaming in and Tatey's one of the great mate of mine. He's a gentleman on the field but he bowled absolute gas. It was so fast and I just knew if I don't hit it it's going to hit me, it's going to bloody hurt. I had this big chunk of wheel in my hand and generally bowlers like to hit the top of off stump first ball and you know, eyes are half closed and swing hard and I actually thought I hit it straight up in the air. But then you just see it sort of sailing and sailing. But yeah, again, it's one of those moments you talk about, but like a catch and yeah, it's just one of those cool things that you look back on and unfortunately no one of. Well, there's a few more years left at the Gabba, but after that, yeah, it could be the last time the Bulls win out of the Gabba.
Magnus:You reckon that's the biggest six that's ever been hit.
Chris:Well, there's three. There's two other ones that have gone out of the Gabba, dan Christian and Brett Lees, and you know it's up for debate who's the biggest. I personally think I've hit the biggest, but I think there's two other opinions that say theirs are as well.
Magnus:What about internationally? What's the?
Chris:biggest six that you think you've seen hit overseas. Oh, overseas, I've seen Chris Gale hit some monsters, Corrin Pollard as well, and Andre Russell you know the West Indians, big longvers. You know, if I was that big, I'd be going to hit it just as far.
Chris:But like they're just different beasts. They've got these fast twitch fibers and it's so effortless. But it's probably a training actually, because like they're just the net balls are coming in and they're just I'm going on them and they're going absolutely miles and you're just saying wow. But the funny thing is they can translate that into a game because they're so relaxed and carefree. It's so cool to watch.
Magnus:How does it compare? I just thought we mentioned baseball before. How far are you hitting a cricket ball compared to some of that, because some of there are some big, big boys that hit those baseballs, and how far are they hitting the baseballs in compared to how far you're hitting the cricket ball?
Chris:Most of the boundaries of home runs are about 100 metres. I'm going to say in baseball in the major league, and to hit 100 metres six, that's a decent whacking cricket. I reckon the one I hit Tatey for was about 140. It registered about 144 or something. I reckon it registered about 120-odd. Yeah, but that Fox measurement's a bit of a guess.
Lucas:Yeah, they always complain about it. On the commentary.
Don:Yeah, it was more like 144 somewhere.
Chris:I know how it works but I won't give it away. But yeah, they're a little bit fudged here and there, but the baseballs do hit it further. The ball's got four seams and it can play in a bit more. But yeah, in cricket we can hit the ball 360 degrees. Obviously, our biggest ones are generally square over the wicket, where you can use the pace of the ball coming at you top of the bounce, whereas theirs are generally against the grain. So it's just pretty impressive.
Lucas:I was going to say is the ball coming the same speed, cricket and baseball.
Chris:Yeah, close to it Like 100-mile-an-hour pitch is Jeff Thompson, 160 kilometres. No one's really hit that for probably 10 years now. But 150 is still pretty quick. But that's around a pitcher as well.
Lucas:When there's a bowler pitching that fast and now I'm asking questions on the cricket, still I'm curious. I'm curious the speed. When you know there's a fast bowler coming at you and you love hitting fast bowls, you said before what speed do you think is like? Okay, I've got to prepare myself for this one because I know this is going to come faster than I'm used to hitting, I think, above 140, I reckon, or 145.
Chris:Faster than I'm used to hitting Anything above 140, I reckon, or 145. When a bloke has got the ability to go up a gear and get it around here or blow your toe off, that's when you've got to nearly even premeditate your swing.
Don:When does it become too dangerous? We've seen the other side of it.
Chris:I got hit flush in the head this year in a big bash. Yeah, I suppose that's the challenge of professional cricket to club cricket. It's always going to be dangerous, but the best can find a way and adapt.
Magnus:I think you've got to adapt. But you pointed out like you played rugby league in those early years and you know the knocks that you're getting to the head without at least you've got a helmet on in cricket, I suppose.
Chris:Yeah, it's just a different fear. I've spoken to guys like Petro Suna, siva, shane Webke, gordon Tallis. They would much rather tackle a big Jordan Malata or someone of their calibre than face Brett Lee, whereas I'm doing the opposite any day of the week. Everyone's got their own method to their madness. Some like catching big waves. You know, some people have wired differently, but that's the mental and physical strength of it.
Magnus:Playbook. Tell us about that. How did it start?
Chris:How did it start? Well, through the double shoulder recon, I was sitting there going. What opportunities have I been given and what's made me the different made a difference in my career, and I believe that extra quality, mentoring and quality coaching not every kid has the same ability to be coached by you know the Jimmy Mars of the world and the Australian players. So how could I give back and create that? Yeah, but not only in cricket, in all sports. So, if I'm going to narrow it down, it's like Uber for sports coaches you type in your location and your sport and the coaches that are signed up will pop up and we do our due diligence with every coach. It's a working with children's card, which is very important.
Chris:We do a police check, just basically making sure the parents have got the peace of mind of dropping off their kids at their venue of choice with a background and, as I said, peace of mind of dropping off their kids at their venue of choice with a background and, as I said, peace of mind that it's going to be a quality session. And then, like Uber, you've got a feedback rating and I just feel like we're professionalising private coaching. Everyone loves cash, but if you can just keep up to speed with the modern world. Again we send coaches out to country areas that don't get the same opportunities. And just accessibility. I found that I keep referring back to guys like Alan Borda, but that era they were always accessible at whatever level it was. Players now aren't, and I'm just giving that again the same opportunity.
Chris:What's changed?
Lucas:do you?
Chris:think they're just more protected, aren't they? There's a lot more hurdles. There's camera phones, there's everything.
Lucas:Media agencies.
Don:There's Spotify and their image is a lot more valuable than what they used to be. That's right.
Chris:No one got paid the kind of money, there's red flags, there's legislations, as you can do as can't do, as their sponsors. So players of Olympic level are not untouchable, but hard to get to.
Don:But also and also everything they say and do are criticized and watched.
Chris:That's right and some people like hiding and that's fair enough. But some people love coaching. This is an avenue to give back to their sport and for me it's rewarding. The best session I ever did was was this kid was nonverbal, and when I say nonverbal, he still spoke but was very shy. So on a Zoom during COVID he would ask his brother the question and it was a half-hour Zoom. After 27 minutes he then spoke to me. I was like how cool is that? Mum's in the background like crying because she spent money on therapists and whatnot. But just the power of what athletes can do was so satisfying. I'm like now he goes to big bash games. He's got signs. It's like it's so epic that's cool.
Chris:so we're not all about. Yes, you can play for shreya if you want it, or you might want to go from wing to 5-8, move up the batting order, or you just want the confidence to play a team sport, like you know. If you've got confidence, you can just do whatever you want. It might be guest speaking, it might be doing a podcast, it might be you know just….
Don:So how does it work? How does your app work for an athlete? How does it work for an aspiring athlete? Or it doesn't even need to be an athlete, right, If someone wants to?
Chris:have a session. You've got a body, you're an athlete, right, so you might just want to. As I said, you might just want to play third grade, or your dad might be. You know FIFA, fly in, fly out, and he can't throw balls for his kids, so it's a perfect opportunity to jump on Playbook type in kangaroo, point and cricket, and all these coaches will come up and you know the coach's name, their own price, time location. So, for example, I'm a bit more on the expensive side.
Lucas:Why is that? Because I like money.
Magnus:Fair enough, that's a good point.
Don:That's a great point, great answer.
Chris:No, because obviously your times.
Chris:But there's guys out there that might charge $30 or $40 an hour because they actually just love the game and personally I don't want to do a lot of sessions, so you do take a lot of the audience out. But we've got guys like Adam Shalour from AFL, who are cheaper again but love coaching and he takes a great sense of reward from that. Dane Zorgo from the Brisbane Lions loves coaching once a week because he played well one game after doing a playbook session with a young kid so he felt like he had to do that in his routine. So everyone's got different aspects and, as I said, you're wired.
Don:Motivation for you to do it is different, absolutely. You're still.
Lucas:What I'm interested in is how you've gone with these retirees that are wanting to give back or in some form, but the coaching is not for them. So what I've heard from Olympians or ex-Olympians or ex-athletes that have made it, they feel like they've done their, I guess, give back to the sport, to the industry, and then 20 years later they go well, people want me, but I just don't want to do it. Do you hear this? Is there a thing that comes about like at some point you go, well, it's just not. I can't physically give anymore.
Chris:A little bit, but generally they've got a passion in something else. So where we find we get guys like that that want to, you know, just make a little bit more extra cash. So from a selfish point of view, yes, it's giving back, but it's helping them transition out of the game. Or if it's a young kid coming through that's trying to make it for the Queensland Bulls and study, how can he just make a few extra bucks every week? Netball's our biggest sport on the platform because the females don't get paid as much as the males generally in sport. So, yeah, they love coaching because it just feeds them an extra few dollars and they don't have to get a full-time job or whatever it may be, it's kind of like a freelance role, yeah it is.
Lucas:So it doesn't have to be. I'm where my mind goes. It doesn't have to be like the people who are like the best of the best and they're 50 or 60 years old now trying to give back. It could be a young generation.
Chris:Yeah, you could just be a third-grade guy that absolutely loves cricket and you go down to train at Toonville Cricket Club. You know what? I'm going to open my calendar for 45 minutes before training. Who wants me to throw balls? And he's getting rewarded for that and he's giving back to the game. So this is not just online.
Don:No, it's one-on-one small groups team sessions.
Chris:So you can set up anything. So the Gilmeister does a lot of tackling sessions for us because safety is massive and we've just started a thing called Playbook Connect which is our white label product to get in clubs and schools and basically keeps going back to growing the game. Keeping kids in sport because you know all the boarders at Nudgee once you finish grade 12, where do they go if they're not earning heaps of money or whatever, or they're studying? They can go back and individual coach or do a team at Nudgee and this is just keeping them one in the school and two in the sport.
Don:So all of the coaches and everyone can be on there like anyone.
Lucas:Anyone. Anyone can be on there, any sport that you don't have right now.
Chris:We've got 32 sports. We've got 32 sports. We've got a scooter coach.
Don:We've got a lawn balls coach.
Lucas:Wow, yeah cool.
Chris:Yeah it's exciting You've got a nice hockey coach. Oh, you know what I actually do.
Lucas:Is it Magnus Olsen?
Chris:Yeah, I was going to say Magnus Olsen, it's each other's team mate, but no, like it's, and you're not locked into contracts. You know when I'm in tournament, I just changed my profile to online mentoring, so obviously if I'm in Adelaide, I'll just. If anyone wants to book me, I could be from Sydney, from Adelaide, from Brisbane, Dubai. Very simple product, but it's one that I'm proud of, of giving back to the just, not only the Amacria, but the community.
Don:Yeah, it's a great idea, Like when I was wanting to get back into track and field as a Masters athlete right, I couldn't find any coach that was willing to coach. It took me a while, right, it was more like, especially in track and field, most of the coaches are looking for their meal ticket, right, they want the golden ticket, they want the next gold guard, right, and that's never going to be me, that's never going to be a master's athlete. Um, we, we don't. Most of master's athletes don't do it for the glory. Their motivation is very different. Um, fortunately, I found the right, went through like three or four different avenues and finally found the right coach and ended up being an absolutely amazing coach and a mentor to me as well. And four years on, you know I'm not with that coach anymore, but that gave me the transition. But that journey was so hard and I talked to a lot of masters athletes and there's a lot of us not just in track and field, but in every sport.
Don:I think something like this is going to be really pivotal. Fantastic initiative Letting them figure out how to get back in.
Chris:Yeah.
Don:And the biggest barrier is how do you get back in? Because when you're hitting 30, 40, hardest part is getting back in and without some coaching it's next to impossible.
Chris:Yeah, and the biggest thing is people think you have to be invited to be a coach. You don't have to Like is people think you have to be invited to be a coach.
Lucas:You don't have to. We're open to all ages, all abilities, all around Australia. We haven't got a certification to become a coach, is what you're saying? There's no criteria around that, as long as you've got your working with children's car, which is obviously very important.
Don:We've got a police check on you as well. I was going to say are there any?
Chris:checks, pick all those boxes.
Don:Yeah, I want to get back into the business side of it. Like you're an elite athlete that was playing cricket. Like, how did you come up with this idea? And then how did you actually make it work and turn it into a business?
Chris:What was that journey like? How did I come up with it? I'm always thinking. Your brain's always thinking about the next business venture. I'm sure you guys think alike.
Don:Have you tried any other ones before this, or is this your first one?
Chris:This is the first proper one.
Don:What are the ones that failed? I always love them.
Chris:Well no, like you're laying at night or if you've had a few beers you're like I've got a great business plan type thing.
Lucas:You wake up the next day and you're like, yeah, that was not good. Yeah, that's not good. That's the worst of the ever type thing.
Chris:But I suppose, Same as you, you would have had a few. I was literally sitting in the pub with my business partner going I think we're talking about Uber and we're like how can we translate that into coaching and give kids the same access? That I did, that I got.
Don:How did you get a business?
Chris:partner. Well, he was my first first grade captain when I was 16 and, um, basically I had a good year and then the next year was horrible. And he, first thing he did is drop me. I was like and then the next year I was captain, what's the first thing I did? Dropped him. But then when I've returned professional, he's a financial planner, I trade and and he said, john, we look after your portfolio. I was like, that's great, because when I'm on tour I can just look after me.
Chris:Cricket number one. That's why I've got to relearn how to put other people first and then we just gain trust. Trust is few and far between now and it's very important. So that's how we come up with Playbook and the thing. We've been live for five years now.
Chris:But people are just starting to hear about us and the thing is there's been competitors out there, but after 12 months they're gone and it's so easy. Well, if it's easy, everyone would do it. So it's not. It hasn't been an easy journey. You know we're in our second capital raise now. Um, we raised the before our first raise. I, I chucked in a fair bit and the tech company went bust, you know, so lost a truckload of money there, so could have easily just thrown in the towel. But I can see the future of this where it can be, not only in Australia, but you know, go to New Zealand, go to England. So we're excited about it. But, as I said, just because there's a few hurdles doesn't mean you throw it in, and that's what our competitors have done and we think we've got a great product. And for me, yeah, it's my baby.
Lucas:This is your living legacy. Right Like this is how you can get back to the grassroots to get the next generation of cricketers, but any sport.
Chris:Yeah, that's right, and it's so simple as well, like people think to come up with an idea.
Don:It's got to be yeah, all this this is what I mean in it, in its um, at the base level. It's what everyone's looking for right like making that, giving that accessibility, yeah, to someone else. I that's what I touched on earlier when it when you talk about sports psychologists or performance coaches, right, like it's really hard to find them.
Chris:Yeah.
Don:Is that something do you guys have? How many? Do you have any performance coaches on there?
Chris:or sports psychologists We've got a couple, not like big well-known, because not everyone's well-known, but it's a space that is growing in Australia, not just like our platform, but it's a space that a lot of people are diving into because, you know, you see TikToks, you see Instagram posts and it's all about wellness and wellbeing and mindset and morning routine.
Don:So you need more on there. Yeah, we are looking for more on there. Yeah, a lot of people we talk to like the importance of the sports psychology the sports psychologist that's and, as you said, they don't put their faces on billboards.
Lucas:It's the same as mental health in general. People don't talk about it enough. It's the same conversation.
Magnus:Yeah, I think, though, when you look at it from a grassroots perspective, sport's all about having fun. I think the psychology very much is some kids that need some help with it. But if you're just going out there and just having fun and you're moving, that's the most important thing without getting too caught up with.
Chris:But that's your coach. Yeah, but then at an elite level. The psychology is important.
Don:But that's to a certain extent, right. But the problem is, even in grassroots sports, every kid is striving to be elite, right, and only a certain amount of people make it. There's, every year, there's 500 Australian athletes that will represent Australia, right, there's thousands of other kids that doesn't make it that want to. Yeah.
Lucas:You're saying this is the edge. The psychology part is the edge that will give you. You've got to have the ability absolutely, but this is the edge that will get you above.
Magnus:But there's still plenty of kids out there, though. I think when it comes to sport, they're just a Div 3 player and they're happy to be a Div 3 player and they enjoy it. They come there with their mates. They may want to go and get a coach and get up to Div 2, but like yourself, you know you might realise that you're not going to be elite, but a coach will still help.
Don:They still need that support right, there's going to be so many times.
Chris:There's only so many times times you can lose before you really like to keep it. Yeah, you have a team coach. You might not necessarily agree with his coaching style, so you can go out and find an individual coach. You might have two, you know, you might.
Don:You might have a bowling coach and you might have a batting coach, like it's yeah, man, I think it's important to anyone like you always think your coach is going to be the person you always turn to the coach, but they don't. They might not always always have the capability or the qualifications to do it.
Chris:I've had the coach my first coach since I was 16. Not my first coach, sorry, but Gavin Fitness is his name and I've had him since I was 16. What's his name? Gavin Fitness yeah, funny that. And like, wherever I am in the world, he watches my games and, like a feedback won't be a 20-minute phone call. It might be a 20-minute phone call. It might be a text with a couple of words that I know, like in my hands or my head or whatever it may be my thought process. He knows, he knows you better than you know you. That's right, how good. One of the reasons why we started, because that helped my journey, just having that specific coach and mentor to look over you. And you know, it's a cool feeling to have someone by your side when you he's not physically there but he's.
Lucas:You know they're watching from home in the last five years, what has been the biggest challenge with transitioning from being an athlete to now running a tech platform business, and what's been the biggest challenge in the business? Um?
Chris:probably keeping my cricket at that level because obviously I've got a lifespan in cricket. Your lifespan in the business world can be forever. But how do I keep my body fit? You know, because you want to prioritize business meetings and your network to build that. But how do I stay on top of my game? How do I not go through flat periods? How do I juggle things?
Lucas:Have you had to learn to say no to a lot of things?
Chris:That's been massive and massive. Do you want to come for a beer? No, do you want to go do this and being on tour missing your mates? You know weddings, things like that. You know the sacrifices you make, but now that you've got a family, I find it much easier, because that's the reward at home the startups right being a startup, being a founder how's that been for you?
Don:It's not an easy journey. Right? You said you've done capital raising twice.
Lucas:It's a full-time job. Raising capital is a full-time job?
Chris:Yeah, it is, but I find going to career training doesn't really excite me anymore. I do it because it's, you know, not because I love it, but it's my job, right. But I get my muscle memory back in. I'm really excited every time I go to a business meeting because I know it's a new avenue, a new wire that I haven't crossed before. So meeting new people, whereas I feel like in career you're still developing and you never stop learning but it's not as exciting as what I feel is a new chapter coming up for me. What's been the biggest challenge? I wouldn't say I was an A-grade student, so just keeping up with you know, a really successful businessman in the room and trying to make sure you don't look like an idiot or a moron. You might sit there and just sort of nod your head, but don't speak and don't throw out this.
Lucas:All the terminology is completely different Diarrhea that's not me, you know.
Chris:I feel like I'm pretty genuine in my approach. I'm willing to learn, but don't try and be someone you're not, because, at the end of the day, I'm not a businessman.
Lucas:I want to You're an expert on the field. How do you?
Don:fix that.
Lucas:Did you?
Don:surround yourself with people that.
Chris:Yeah, well, you, just one step at a time. You're just looking in the right now or not, trying to pretend you're someone else, like your vocab's. Only this big Don't try and yeah, throw out these words or, you know, just stay in your lane. Admit that you do need help, right.
Magnus:Be curious, ask questions.
Chris:Yeah, ask questions. On the cricket field you puff your chest out. If you're out of form, you bluff it. But you can't bluff in business meetings and you're allowed to admit that your skill set is not as great as his or his or his. But I'm willing to learn and I'm willing to volunteer my time with nothing in return. A lot of people now are like you know what, I'll do this for you. Yeah, okay, where's the catch? Do stuff for free and volunteer, and I find that gets you a lot further than….
Don:How does your commercial model work? How does that work for athletes and?
Chris:for yourself. Well, as an athlete, I know what I demand in the cricket space, but I don't know what my demand is in the business space. I know a lot of people want to chat to me about cricket, so they will use oh hey, mate, let's have a chat about playbook. But then in an interview all they do is just talk about the score in the Sheffield Shield or whatever, and then they'll just put a sentence of playbook at the end. So they try and get you through other avenues and I feel like I've pretty switched on with all that now because they're the time wasters. I'm not a big fan of that.
Magnus:All right, let's wrap it up. Quickfire questions. You ready? Let's go One word your closest mates would use to describe you.
Chris:Aggressive.
Magnus:A current bowler that you least look forward to facing.
Chris:Rashid Khan.
Magnus:Achievement you're most proud of in your career.
Chris:Not really my career, but my daughter.
Magnus:Who's the best test cricketer in the world right now?
Chris:Pat.
Magnus:Cummins, who, in your career, taught you the most about life off the pitch? Darren Lehman, what would you rather face? A 160-kilometre bouncer or a three-minute ice bath?
Chris:Alan would be an ice bath.
Magnus:What's your most memorable on-field moment last year?
Chris:On-field moment last year. Actually, I was on a run. I won three tournaments in a row. I went on a tour with four tournaments and I ended up winning yeah, three in a row and the other one I come second. So that was probably the coolest, well done.
Magnus:What's the best performance you've witnessed from a teammate?
Chris:Best performance I've witnessed. Luke Pommersback actually in the Big Bash we won it in year two of the Big Bash Scored a magnificent 100 at Marvel against Murley and I happened to be at the other end and then in the other semifinal we had to win. We had to chase 130 off, 13 overs, and it was him again and then in the final he got us home to win our first big race title for Brisbane.
Magnus:Yeah, good One guilty pleasure food. You can't resist. Pizza Morning routine.
Chris:I'm up early. I like to get up when the sun gets up, so in the summer, 4.30, 4.30ish. In the winter a little bit later. But I like to get up when the sun gets up. So in the summer, 4.30, 4.30ish. In the winter a little bit later. But I like to get up. Fortunately enough, I live on the beach, so I get up, either go to the gym and then the beach or vice versa. But win the morning, win the day, as they say.
Magnus:What's your best ever golfing figures?
Chris:I got down to a nine, but yeah, this morning I would have been well over that.
Magnus:What's the best round? What have you done? What's the best score you've had in a round?
Chris:I don't think I've broken 80 yet. I think my best is 80. In Abu Dhabi, we were in the COVID bubble and we were wrapped inside a golf course Sadio Beach and we just played every day, because that's what we're allowed to do.
Magnus:Probably won a few longest drive competitions in the day yeah of course, I lost a lot of balls. A talent or skill. You wish you had Play golf. If you had to give up cricket for one year and try another profession, what would that be? Baseball yeah, favourite song you must sing along to.
Chris:Favourite song. I'm into Luke Combs at the moment, the Fast Car remix. Yeah, I reckon that's just an easy listen.
Magnus:All right, last one. What's one thing you wish every young athlete knew before they went off to chase their dream?
Chris:Don't panic.
Don:Yeah, panic last, I do have one. Considering this is a cricket one, I want to ask each panelist who your favourite cricketer is.
Chris:Mine would have been Shane Warne. Yeah, warne is up there, but I think Jax Callis is the best cricketer this world's ever seen and I've beenax Cullis is the best cricketer this world's ever seen and I've been lucky enough to play with him, play against him, bat ball and catch him. It's just, he's unbelievable and his tempo, like we talk about being relaxed, he was asleep before he'd walk out of the bat and test cricket and just a great fella.
Lucas:I loved watching McGraw. He was kind of like my idol when I was growing up. I just loved watching him. And then I got the opportunity to meet him and his family when I was out skiing in Whistler when I did a season there. That was really, really cool.
Chris:And yours.
Don:Should be a Sri Lankan right. But nah, Jonty Rhodes, there we go. He bought the entertainment in Test Cricket and everything. Attitude.
Chris:Buildings attitude Loved it, loved it.
Magnus:Thank you so much, lenny. An absolute pleasure as usual, mate, and all the best for Playbook, and we'll put something in the show notes for our listeners to come find you.
Lucas:Awesome. Thank you very much. Thank you, boys. Thanks for being here, man.
Magnus:It's been awesome. Hope you enjoyed this exciting episode of the mastering podcast. If you got value from today's conversation, hit that subscribe button now and share this episode with a friend. Until next time.