The Mastering Podcast

The 10,000-Hour DJ: Building a Music Career from Scratch | Up-&-Comming Australian DJ and Producer Yussi

• The Mastering Team • Season 1 • Episode 5

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Yussi's transformation from civil engineering student to international drum and bass producer offers a masterclass in artistic dedication and modern music entrepreneurship. With over 167,000 monthly Spotify listeners and a European tour on the horizon, his story demolishes the stereotype of electronic musicians as mere "button pushers."

The South African-born, Australian-based artist reveals how his passion ignited at a quarry party on the Sunshine Coast, leading to humble beginnings with a camping table set up at house parties. The pivotal moment came when he abandoned the security of his engineering career to pursue music production full-time—a decision that demanded extraordinary commitment. Yussi meticulously logged his production hours, surpassing the mythical 10,000-hour threshold separating hobbyists from masters.

His cross-genre approach to drum and bass separates Yussi from countless other electronic producers. Rather than recycling standard samples, he deliberately incorporates elements from house, R&B, and other styles to create a signature sound that stands apart while remaining accessible. This strategy exemplifies his philosophy that developing a unique artistic identity builds a more sustainable career than chasing trending sounds for short-term gains.

The conversation takes a fascinating turn when exploring the business realities behind the artistic facade. Yussi candidly discusses the 60/40 split between music creation and marketing that defines his current workflow, the strategic relationships with multiple record labels rather than exclusive deals, and how working with the right management opened doors previously inaccessible. For aspiring producers, his insights into maintaining physical and mental health amidst creative obsession provide a crucial blueprint for sustainable success.

Whether you're a music production enthusiast or simply curious about how creative careers unfold in the digital age, Yussi's journey demonstrates that becoming exceptional requires more than talent—it demands relentless practice, strategic thinking, and the courage to forge your own sonic identity. Subscribe now and join the conversation about what it truly takes to master your craft.


Find Yussi on Spotify, SoundCloud and Instagram @yussiyussiyussi to check out his music, including his 30 new tracks in development.

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Don:

Hold on. So lip syncing happens in DJing.

Yussi:

Pretty much.

Magnus:

Okay, like, how did you go from playing house parties to touring in Europe Camping table?

Yussi:

The decks, the buttons.

Ryan:

Yeah, yeah, the buttons.

Magnus:

One player button. Thank you, welcome to the Mastering Podcast. I'm the host, magnus Olsson, and joining me today I have my co-host, don Sanka, masters, athlete and entrepreneur, and our second co-host is.

Ryan:

Ryan Go on say it, Give it a crack Skillet potato Is that what you said, yus?

Yussi:

Yeah, skillet scallop.

Ryan:

Scallops, scallops, silly potty, shilliporte. Shilliporte I'd like Ryan to introduce our special guest. So I did manage to drag him out of his hovel. That is a room Out of the cave. Out of the cave, pull him away from his decks and his computer. So today we are hosting Yossi. Now Yossi is a DJ, but I think the term producer is more apt. Producer, both, both, whatever floats, and you've been a producer now for six years, seven years, yeah, about six, seven years.

Yussi:

I've been doing it properly for about six.

Ryan:

Yeah, and up and comer in the scene. He's played tracks with Coven Lude. You've been on tour internationally now and I think over 167,000 monthly listeners on Spotify as of yesterday or today?

Yussi:

Yeah, it's just ticked over.

Ryan:

It's going up and up Updated. I'm up with it.

Magnus:

So I'm curious Yassi, is it just Yassi? How did you name? Is that your last name?

Yussi:

So I was born in South Africa and my last name is pronounced Ace, but it's spelt U-Y-S, so no one ever gets it right. And when I was younger, obviously moving to Australia from South Africa, they tell you everything under the sun. That isn't the actual way to say your name. So I got ooey's, I got eyes, and one day.

Yussi:

I'll never forget it. A principal called me up to get something at school and she said, yes, cameron, yes, and I just never forgot it because you know, the Y is not even in front of the U there Fast forward. I'm at uni, at the accommodation, when I was studying civil engineering, and I was just drunk at the table one day and we would all carve our names into the table at the uni accommodation and I wrote yes, and then, about 15 beers deep, I thought I'm getting somewhere with this and I put another S and an I on the end and suddenly that's how Yassie came and that was. I'd been searching for an artist name for two years, trying to force stuff, and that one was just it's like my name, it sort of rings nice, so that's how it came about.

Ryan:

What are the names? I've actually not heard. What are the names?

Don:

Did you come up with? What's the process Like before we go into the art of DJing? I want to try to get answers out. How does most of these artists right? They have their real name and then they've got their stage name right?

Yussi:

Well, a lot of them. The stage name just is the real name.

Don:

Is it?

Yussi:

I mean maybe it's a variation, like John Summit I name. Yeah, is it? I mean maybe it's a variation like john summit.

Don:

I mean, maybe his name is john. If deadless is the real name, then I'm. Yeah, that's gotta be lewd.

Ryan:

For sure that's real that's real.

Don:

So what? What's the process? How do you you know? Well, for me that was what are the other names? I?

Yussi:

actually don't remember the other ones. This, this is like seven, eight years ago.

Ryan:

I would have loved to have heard those names.

Don:

So is it just one Yassi, or is there Yassi and a Yassi and a Yassi?

Yussi:

There's three Yassis, because I've seen your names, oh yeah, so it turns out Yassi is a very common. I think it's a Spanish name, maybe.

Magnus:

So that everywhere. So that's why I did the three yussies at the, on the instagram, all the socials, but so it's one. Yes, it's one yussie, one yussie, right? Okay? Well, the dj scene's pretty crowded, apart from your name yussie, which is fairly different.

Yussi:

What makes you stand out from the crowd? Uh well, I think it's the way that you, whatever genre you work in, like I work in drum and bass, right, which is, for anyone who doesn't know, it's a fast-paced electronic genre like a, you know, clubby sort of music, rave sort of music, and cue music working, working in um within that genre.

Yussi:

Something I've always liked doing is bringing inspiration from other genres and pulling it in. So we work with like sample packs, for example. That's where you like grab the sounds to make the song I'll sometimes make a whole drummer bass track but like just using sounds from a house music pack or from an r&b pack and then you essentially get like this unique product within that market which would be completely mainstream in another market. So it's interesting like you can create this thing here that's unique within the confines of the one genre by doing that. So that's something that I've done pretty extensively and it's actually helped me a lot and I'll get into it later with like our remixes and that sort of thing coming.

Don:

But yeah, it's actually become. Can I take a couple of steps back and just can you tell me what the hell drum and bass is like? There's three generations of us here right, yeah however, music cuts across everything, and I think it predates you.

Magnus:

I don't know. Bice is a guitar and drums are the things that you hear.

Don:

But I want to try and understand the history of this Growing up, jungle music was big right.

Yussi:

That's where it came from, is that right? Yeah, that's what I thought. So drum and bass came from jungle in the 90s okay, and then? It's turned into more of like a modern electronic based uh genre as time and technology is with an evolution of rave.

Don:

Right like you, you had the raves then became what he called it came from breakbeat.

Yussi:

Yeah, breakbeats and breaks. That's where the sort of um of style of drums, which is sort of signature in drum and bass, comes from. Yeah so yeah, I mean without getting too nerdy into it, that's essentially it.

Ryan:

Go, go go.

Don:

This is called mastering, and the whole point of it is to sort of understand.

Yussi:

Yeah, I'll get an amen break playing now and we can show you guys. That's sort of where it came from. It's sort of a lot in the drums and the tempo. So drum and bass is typically written between 170 and 175 BPM. Yeah, for reference, house music's about 120 to 130.

Yussi:

So it's like a fast pace, so it's faster and faster, yeah, you don't really go faster than that in the electronic world, aside from super crazy techno of hard star where it's just going do, do, do, do. But drum and bass is one of the faster-paced genres. That's like one of its what would you call it. I guess it's signature aspects or traits.

Magnus:

What are some of the other genres out there that are popular at the moment? What are some of the other genres out there that are popular at the moment Within the electronic realm.

Yussi:

Yeah, you've got house music, you have heavier forms like trap and dubstep, you have techno, you have hard style you have, and then all of these break down into subgenres and that's the thing, like house music or drum and bass, that's sort of your blanket mother genre.

Yussi:

But then that breaks down into all these, all these sub genres underneath, and a lot of them you're finding a blurring these days. So I think between 2000 and well, the 2000s and the 2010s, because technology was rapidly evolving, all these new genres were birthing and sort of even using a certain tempo on its style of sound would just make a new, a new sub genre, a new genre. But now we're finding that because there's such a surplus of the availability to get samples and make music and anyone can do it you know, if you've got a laptop and you have access to the internet, you have a bit of money, the world at your fingertips with that that now all the electronic genres are sort of taking from one another, sort of like what I said. And then all these fusion genres are sort of taking from one another, sort of like what I said. And then all these fusion genres are sort of born and now it's just yeah, it's a weird time in the scene where there's not clearly defined boundaries between genres.

Don:

Now, so if you go back, you've got rave, you've got the hip-hop coming into the rave. I'm still trying to understand.

Yussi:

And then you've got jungle music. See, I think this is all still before I was born, by the way, see, I think this is all still before I was born, by the way.

Don:

I'm going that far, so the 90s. So you got it kept getting faster and faster, and faster and faster, it's like, and then we've ended up here.

Yussi:

Well, obviously, like electronic music, it runs parallel to advances in technology. So it was really around 2000, and I want to say 2010 onwards, when you get what are called plugins, which are essentially digital versions of synthesizers that, like analog synthesizers, a lot of them become more readily available and a lot more powerful on the computer.

Yussi:

And you can just buy them for a few hundred dollars and make pretty much any sound you wanted and make pretty much any sound you wanted. So then suddenly, this just explosion happened of all these new genres, just because all these new sounds that people typically couldn't use before are now being made.

Don:

What's the attraction with the faster beats right, like why are we getting faster and faster with these beats We've gone from? Is that a cultural change? Is it a societal change? Is societal change or yeah, probably a detention span? That's what I wanted to know is it because we are so like looking for that that?

Yussi:

big drum and bass is still quite niche. Yeah, if you look in the broader spectrum, and electronic itself is niche in the broad spectrum of music. So yeah, I think, I think it's just the special ones like me who are just into it, but the drops are there, right.

Don:

Like even when you listen to a normal piece of music, the beats are there. Yeah, it's slowly creeping in, right, and you've got this beat drop that you'll find and things like TikTok. It's those beat drops, that sort of….

Yussi:

Yeah, yeah, like, like I said, a fusion of genres. You now see, pop music is getting a lot of electronic influence. Electronic music is now getting a lot more vocal oriented as well. So a lot of the new stuff that I'm writing these days, instead of just having sort of a build-up that goes into a fully electronic, you know sound, sort of drop, yeah, I'll quite often have vocals over the drop so people can sing to it.

Yussi:

So there's elements that are sort of crossing over from both worlds, from like pop and hip hop into the electronic world and from rock and back and forth, and I love it because working, I've learned to work with that and that's something that going forward. Well, it's something I've already been able to use to carve out a niche for myself in the scene, because instead of you know a lot of people. For example, if there's a producer, a drum and bass producer, using sample packs for drum and bass, they sound a lot like other people. But by not doing that, I've been able to set myself apart and almost create this like, almost skip some parts of the scene in general. So yeah, it's interesting like, but there's also there's other sides to that.

Yussi:

So the more unique you go, the less short-term gains you get from the scene.

Yussi:

And what I mean by that is that whatever's trending because the genres there's constantly the sub genres are trending and everything moves around if you adhere to a certain trend, you can get quickly like a quicker following and more people get around it because that sound is in style.

Yussi:

But if you, if that trend then goes away and you've associated yourself too much with that sound, people might stop listening to you because they're sick of that sound. The longer route is figuring out your own unique sound and it takes a long time a a longer time to build, but it's I think it's a stronger fan base because they like you for you, and they listen to your music because they like your music, not because they like that genre. So, yeah, that's sort of the route I've taken, and it's taken a little while to get here. It took quite a lot longer to like. It's one thing to learn how to produce music well, but then to get to a point of producing your own style, well, that is something that other people still will like, because obviously there's also a point where you can produce music that's unique to you but people might not even like it. So what's?

Don:

what's the difference between a DJ and a producer? Right, like I'm going back showing my age again like Kim between a DJ and a producer?

Yussi:

right, like I'm going back showing my age again, like Kimberland, was like that defining sort of producer, separating himself from Well, the DJing is the performance aspect of it. So I'm a DJ producer. I produce my tracks and I release them on Spotify. When I go and play shows, I'm DJing those tracks out. That's how electronic musicians perform their art instead of, you know, a guitar or playing in a band or that sort of stuff.

Magnus:

Yeah, what do you say to people that call djs just button pushes and you're not a true artist? I mean, we pretty much are.

Yussi:

Yeah, I mean they're probably just not into the music as much, because then if you ask someone who's into electronic music, that probably you know they they get around it they can appreciate the, the, the artistry, but I want to yeah them to go and listen to the soundtrack of your life and most probably it's going to be done by a producer.

Yussi:

Yeah, I think like that, if you look at my, my whole soundtrack, like what defines most of periods of my life, yeah, there'll be a, there'll be a track that's produced oh yeah, most major artists, uh, in terms of like, if you get a singer, for example, um, you know, like a katie perry or taylor swift, they don't just make the song themselves, they have one cog in a wheel of probably 20 plus people to get that song made, you know they'll have. Now it's different. This is not a case for everyone, but sometimes they will just sing the lyrics that have been written by a writer over a track that's been produced by a producer. That whole track gets sent to a mixing and mastering engineer, which makes it sound full and sound good on radio and stuff, um, which then you know gets given to a record label who sets up the release, release and all that.

Yussi:

There's a lot that goes into it. So there's a lot of cooks in the kitchen, especially when you get to the higher levels of the pop realm. Um, that I think people just sort of they don't think about. They just, you know, you hear a Katy Perry song. It's like, oh, she made this whole thing. So yeah, it's interesting.

Yussi:

I think with the electronics scene a lot more of it's done by you. Like I'm making the song myself, I usually feature vocalists because I can't sing. I can try but I can't, and I'll sort of mix and master it myself and then get that to the record label to release.

Magnus:

So you basically can release something with just two people involved. So you've got somebody that does the vocals and then you do everything else yeah, pretty much.

Yussi:

I mean, I even I set up my own record labels so that I can do self-releases as well. Um, but working with a proper label is usually good because they have their own fan base and they usually have budget to put into it as well. That's the main thing. As you go further up, you realize that promoting songs isn't just about the song being good. It's also about money being put into it so that it can be pushed out to as many people, so that more people see it. That's a big part that we can get into as well about coming up as a musician and as a producer d DJ.

Yussi:

Whatever as an artist is, it doesn't matter how good your art is. There's also the component to actually getting it seen by people, and that's where this whole thing with social media then comes in.

Ryan:

I think a big eye-opener for me was actually watching you make music from scratch. Now you see, like orchestras and composers and every part of it. You know there's this. You know hundreds of people sometimes all making this cohesive sound. Now, watching you do that from start to finish, it blew me away. It was a completely different level of respect because you know everyone's like oh, they push buttons. But when you listen to a song, I didn't even realize how many sounds I'm hearing, why I'm feeling that way. When I'm hearing a sound, how it makes me feel and the whole time he's just sitting there like a puppet going. You're going to feel this here, this here, this is how you're going to react to the song and I think that was a massive eye opener for me. But before we go further.

Ryan:

I think the the big question everyone wants to know is, um why you got into this man, like what was the big start?

Don:

yeah, yeah, in this in the intro you said you were doing an engineering degree like yeah, so since I sorry, that was a big 180 there- Sorry, Mum and Dad.

Yussi:

Yeah, it was my parents' dismay at the time. So from when I was five, I wanted to be a civil engineer, which is weird for a five-year-old, but that's what I wanted to be. Hold on, not an astronaut civil engineer no civil engineer, I wanted to build things. Oh, okay, that just makes sense.

Magnus:

Build roads, yeah, infrastructure Bridges.

Yussi:

Yeah, pretty much. And I worked my ass off at the end of school and got into uni. I went to uni on the Sunshine Coast and did a civil engineering degree and worked really hard in that as well. I got my honours in that and while I was doing that pretty much from when I started the degree that's when I started DJing and this was just doing house parties so this is back in the day before any I knew I wanted to be Yussie and I wanted to do drum and bass I just got into the DJing aspect and did that sort of through uni.

Yussi:

And it was when I got towards the end of the degree and I was getting quite good at making music that I really decided that's what I wanted to do. Quite good at making music that I really decided that's what I wanted to do. But to backtrack into how I actually got into the DJing, I think there was a love for electronic music from being. I think it started on YouTube. So when I was younger and I'd be playing online games and that sort of stuff, you just have.

Yussi:

YouTube open and you sort of for the gaming sort of stuff. And a lot of the electronic music at that time was pretty prevalent on youtube and it was uh festivals like tomorrowland and ultra music festival in the us that were the first sort of people to start live streaming the festival so you could see the audience's perspective of a dj.

Yussi:

You could see the dj's perspective playing to the audience and all the sound and everyone going crazy and stuff. And you know I was just like 14 watching this, thinking like that's so cool, I want to be that. And then fast forward after getting into the music from that aspect. Um, right at the end of school I went to my first proper party. It was about 300 people in a quarry out in the hinterland in the sunshine coast and it was the first party I went to that had a dj. Um, and I just thought he was the coolest guy ever. I remember we were down there.

Yussi:

Yeah, it's just. I mean there was something about the fact that the whole, like vibe and the, the whole thing he was sort of controlling it. But also it was just this love for the actual music and I was hearing him play new music that I hadn't heard before. You know I was backtracking to talking about the new genres all exploding. I mean what he was playing that night. I hadn't heard anything like it before and I messaged him after that party. I found him on facebook and I said I want to get into this, and he basically showed me some entry-level equipment to start with, and he bussed down to my house and actually showed me the ropes of DJing and then from there I bought my first little setup to start doing parties and from there, yeah, I spent three hours, I mean.

Magnus:

So just walk us through that. So what sort of equipment did you need to start with? What's the equipment hold you? So it was a camping table the decks.

Yussi:

So which were? I mean, what's a deck? The DJ equipment? Okay, the buttons.

Don:

Yeah, yeah, the buttons, one player button, was that like a proper mixer?

Yussi:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, so it's called a controller, which is basically you have the ones with the turntables on either side and then the mixer in the middle, but it's a digital, so it's not vinyl.

Ryan:

I don't know how to play vinyl.

Don:

Don't get me wrong, don't play, I actually do.

Yussi:

Well you've won up either? Yeah, that's true, I actually do. Well, you've won up either? Yeah, you pretty much have the deck so you can mix the music. You have speakers and then I had like a little strobe light and you know, a smoke machine and stuff. That was all the rave, a strobe and a smoke. Oh, mate, if you don't have a smoke machine.

Don:

You've got to get your mirror ball in the right spot with the lights coming in. Just get someone with a cigarette standing next.

Yussi:

But yeah, I got into that and, to be honest, I mean most people who are into djing. They probably had the usb in the headphones and they could play at the clubs who give you the decks. Yeah, there was probably three of us who actually had a setup in that age bracket, who would be doing those parties, who could do them on the sunshine coast, so we just ruled the market for playing house parties. So what would happen is I played this first party. There's 50 people there at an 18th. One of them probably thinks, oh, that's pretty cool, I want to dj at my party and then you play his. And then the same thing happened. So I didn't have to advertise myself at all and within a month, I was playing like three parties a month every month for about three years and that's how I made my money.

Don:

The difference would be that a proper DJ is playing to the reaction of the audience, rather than putting a USB in right, like you're feeding from and then feeding back right oh when I say putting the USB in, that's where you select the tracks from and then you mix them.

Yussi:

Yeah, no, it the usb and that's where you select the tracks from oh, and then you, and then you mix them yeah, no, it's not like you're putting in a whole set mix for an hour long and then just and letting it.

Ryan:

I've seen that happen too. Oh, it happens, it definitely it doesn't. He does it on his lazy days.

Yussi:

Yeah, it doesn't interesting you could that as you get higher up in the scene. Sometimes they need to do that, especially if they have like fully lighting, lighting and production that's tracked to the music. The whole DJing on the fly thing, actually at higher levels, becomes less Hold on, so lip syncing happens in DJing too Pretty much.

Magnus:

Okay, so that's how you started and I believe that you're on tour. You're going to Europe later this month. I start in May yeah. So, how did you transition, like how did you go from playing yeah. So how did you transition, like how did you go from playing house parties to touring in europe?

Yussi:

well, actually, I stopped djing to get to being able to dj properly and what I mean by that is djing locally only gets you to a certain point. You know, I was playing just as a local guy playing r&B commercial music to house parties. I stopped that in, so I started that in 2016. In 2018, I got really sick of it and I started learning how to actually produce the music, and then the next few years, I'd say until so when you say how to produce the music, like how to actually make the songs, yeah, so not DJing is different. You're just playing other people's music. Producing your own music is what you actually have to do to get past certain levels and to get big in the scene.

Don:

It's very difficult just as a DJ. How did you learn how to do that? How did you learn to come up with your own tune and own music? Like? I think you gave us a little bit of insight into that, but I'd love to.

Magnus:

I'd love to understand the starting point. Yeah, that's the first thing you start Okay, I'm going to produce a song. Now that obviously you know what you're doing, what's the first thing that you need?

Ryan:

I think you subscribe to Yossi's.

Yussi:

Patreon yeah, I do teach people how to make music. Are you saying as in from where I'm at now or when I was starting, how I sort of got into it?

Magnus:

I as in from where I'm at now or when I was starting, how I sort of got into it. I would probably like to know from now, because obviously, with your skill set now and you are a master at that craft is it something that someone comes up to you and says, hey, yossi, can you make a song for me? Or you just make a song that you somehow have dreamt up?

Yussi:

Yeah, I can sometimes just be in the shower or anywhere and a song will just come into my head and starts with an existing song. Does it sometimes? Sometimes I if that the problem with hearing a song in your head is that actually executing that in the in the daw, which is what you make the music on ableton is the one that I use, which is a common electronic one. Uh, it's a lot harder to do it than to actually think it. I can think of a song and I can think of sounds in my head, but it takes years to actually be able to do that.

Yussi:

That's one way is thinking of it, you know, and then trying to execute that. Another way is just pulling sounds in, like samples and all this sort of stuff, and piecing things together until it starts. You know, little ideas come out. You might, you might stack a few sounds on top of each other or put them in sequence and suddenly you're like, oh, that's pretty cool, and then another little idea comes that you can add on to that. So you start usually just with one sound and then, like, and there's all these different aspects.

Yussi:

You could start with a drum beat, or you could start with a vocal and then sort of listen and think about what.

Magnus:

What baseline goes well under the vocal so by the sound of it, like I've got a construction background and before we build something we do a set of drawings, and obviously with your civil engineering degree you'd understand that principle. But with music it's very intuitively based by the sound of it. So it's something that you actually draw a bunch of notes and go this is what I'm going to produce.

Yussi:

You're just coming up with it as you get along A lot of experimentation and I think it's over time and getting your reps in experimenting. That's when you actually learn how to do things. So, like at the beginning I knew nothing at all, I had no musical background, I still don't, I can't play any instrument, but you just get good at pulling in sounds and learning about what different sounds work where.

Don:

You're not tone deaf, right, I'm tone deaf, no, no.

Yussi:

If I was tone deaf then I'd be screwed.

Don:

So you need to have something if you don't play any instruments. Yeah, I know you said, look at now, but I want to know how do you get to that point saying, okay, well, I'm mixing someone else's music too, I want to make my own music, and then I want to have my own beat or my own sound. Yeah, genre, no, no.

Yussi:

Like how you get from just DJing other people's to making your own.

Don:

Yeah, and then defining this is my own song, right.

Yussi:

Yeah, well, I think the first part of that question getting from DJing other people's music to making your own I think just being a fan of a certain style of music so excessively that you actually want to figure out how to make it is what gets you into it. So when I was younger, I didn't really listen to, you know, commercial music. I listened to a bit of green day when I was super young, but most of it was electronic from when I was about 10 onwards, right. So it was this obsessive love with that music which then got me going. Well, I wonder how they make this and it would be really cool to learn how to make this.

Yussi:

Parallel to that, you then start seeing, like I said before, people playing that music live and you see at the upper levels of that, what, what that job and that career path looks like. And it's the combination of seeing the performance aspect with loving the music which then makes you get to the point of wanting to a dj and b learn how to make the music yourself. So there's there's the performance and then there's the actual production of the music that goes into it and then fast forward, like how you actually get better at doing it like with any skill it's you start and know nothing, and then you just keep going for hours and hours.

Ryan:

Do you want to jump in and say how high your reps are?

Yussi:

Yeah, so I hit my 10,000th hour of music production, like a month ago.

Magnus:

Over how many years? Six, six.

Don:

Pretty close to that mastering. Yeah, you passed that now.

Yussi:

Yeah, I think it's like 10,200 now I'm going to keep logging it, no way.

Ryan:

I was going to say. I was like he asked to come early and I said not good enough, you're not cool yet you do have to be a master, you have to have done it for 10,000.

Don:

That's a proper definition. So, mate, good on you. But how do you break through? Like you know, there's DJs and producers everywhere, right? How do you attract those you know, artists, to come and work with you, to collaborate, and how do you break through? And how do you sign a record label? How do you get there?

Yussi:

So for starters, you have to get good at making music, and that was something I saw early on. I realized that anywhere I wanted to go further in that career path, I first had to learn how to make music properly and do it well. And I wanted to do it well enough that I could lean back on that, that I didn't have to force any other. You know marketing and all these other things that, like my production quality, could be a staple reason that people are attracted to you in that industry. So that's when I, that's, that's when you just go into the cave, that's when you go into your room. For years and I basically said you know, I sort of loosely knew about the 10 000 hour rule, whether or not that's real, but I thought, if I do this for 10,000 hours, I'll be good at it. And I started logging and I aimed to hit 30 or 40 hours a week, every week, and I have done that every week since, and that was six years ago, so really it was nothing Like I said.

Yussi:

There was no prior talent, there was no musical genius to me or anything. It was just seeing a career path and lifestyle I wanted and then understanding that, even though I didn't know anything, if I just put in those hours every week and just basically you have to become obsessed with it. I mean that's the only way that something would happen and you go into a pit.

Don:

I think you're selling yourself short. You've got to have some type of music genius there too. Like anyone can practice as much as they want, but if you can't hear that beat, if you can't follow a process and if you can't put it all together, music is one of those things. I hear it every day, it doesn't matter how much I practice.

Magnus:

It's an art, it's like painting.

Yussi:

Yeah.

Magnus:

I guess you're right, that love of the music and you know hearing songs in my head. That definitely helps. I think you can do something for 10,000 hours yeah.

Ryan:

No, I think honestly, man, you're just stubborn, like you're just a problem solver, like you give this guy anything and he'll sit there and try and and work it out, whether it's health, whether it's fitness. He'll say no, because you were absolutely right. Obsessed is the right word. But I did notice, yeah, I did notice earlier. You forgot, like the third way of like making a song. There is a third way. I'm using actual instruments no, no, no just just your friends bullying you into it.

Yussi:

He. He came around one day and just said he wanted me to remix uh, arnold swazhenegger there's an infamous video of him talking about a stogie like a cigar. And he came around and he said he showed me a youtube video. And he said you're turning this into a song before I'm leaving? And I did in like six hours. Wow.

Ryan:

Six months of bullying it took to get that six hours I kept sending him versions.

Yussi:

He said it's cool but it's not really good, and then I'd just go back to the drawing board and make it. Meanwhile I'm trying to actually do a bunch of other songs, but yeah, had to prioritise Ryan's.

Magnus:

So tell us a bit more about the up-and-coming tour and how that opportunity arose.

Yussi:

So yeah. So I, in a short way of answering that, Ivo, a booking agent based in Amsterdam, reached out and he said he's been following my project for a little while and he's seen that I'm quickly gaining traction in the scene. And he asked if he can represent me as my agent over there. And I hopped.

Yussi:

I already had a manager at that point, gabe, and we hopped on a call with him and within an hour we basically had said that it was a good idea to go forward and from that point he now at the moment and for the last six months since that call, has been using his connections in the music scene in europe and the uk to basically pitch me for shows. So his job over there and a booking agent's job. You essentially like as an artist, you usually at some point you'll get a manager who is usually just with you worldwide and a booking agent for different regions. So I have an agent for the australia, new zealand, asia region and now ivo takes care of me in the uk europe region and then at some point you'll I'll probably get one for the us and canada. So your agent basically they're connected in with the music scene in a given region and then they know people to contact to pitch you for shows. So that's how you set up a tour essentially.

Yussi:

He reaches out to people constantly over there that he knows and says there's this guy, yussi he would be a good person to play, to add to this festival or to do a club night so at what point do you decide that you need a manager, or is that the same?

Don:

they come to you, or do you like look at it and say commercially now.

Yussi:

Yeah, it's funny with the manager thing you usually get to a point where you feel like you need one for certain reasons and then that's a good point. Up until then you don't really need a manager. So for me, the point of realizing I needed one was when I felt like I was pushing up against a ceiling that was inhibiting further growth, because there wasn't doors that were open for me and there wasn't connections there from an industry perspective.

Yussi:

So the way I got my manager Gabe he's actually Lude's manager, who is pretty high up in the dance scene and very high up in the drum and bass scene and he liked my music and at one point we were chatting because we were working on a song together and he just asked if I'm managed by anyone and I said no, and he said would you like me to talk to my manager? And I said yeah, that would be amazing. And he did. Lewd asked that, yeah, and he said you want me to talk to gabe? My then, yeah, that led to me hopping on a few doors that are open there that I can't open myself, and a lot of the work comes down to just the grunt work that I'm doing in, you know, finishing music, getting music released, going and playing the shows and stuff.

Yussi:

But there's things here and there that Gabe can contact certain people that I can't. He might know someone at a record label that I don't and say, hey, we've got this artist who's doing quite well, do you want to like listen to their music? And then that might lead to a release with that label, and then slowly you just build it up together. It's like me doing the grunt work, gabe basically helping me from a connection standpoint, but then also there's guidance from him. So obviously, as you get further up in the music scene as an artist, there's different perspectives and ways that you approach doing certain things from the release to the show side and all that, and by him working with an a-list touring artist, like worldwide touring artists.

Yussi:

There's things he can tell me that maybe I'm thinking in this headspace that he has a broader view on and can actually help guide the project, a bit like that. So, yeah, your manager just comes on essentially to help with that. Also, there's admin things like reaching out to labels. For me, I can just say, hey, can you reach out to this label and pitch my music, or can you hit up this artist's or this feature vocalist management team and then yeah, how does labels work?

Don:

is it you have multiple labels or you just sign one?

Yussi:

sign up with one and so in back in the day and I'm talking, like you know, 30, 40 years ago it was pretty much you would sign to one label and they would just release your stuff and I think the labels back then had a bigger part to play in the development of your artist project, sort of like what I was talking about with the manager. The label almost curated your entire um. They gave you a platform and then curated your entire projection as an artist. Nowadays it's a lot more unique to the individual artist and especially in the electronic scene you'll just release singles with labels and if you want to, you can release more.

Yussi:

You can do an ep, you know four tracks, you can do an album, which is usually about 12, uh, but you usually start with singles. And that's what I like to do, because when I've worked with probably like 20 record labels at this point yeah, and quite a few of them there was ones I might have put a few tracks out on maybe one track and then maybe it doesn't work. You know, sometimes the relationship just doesn't work or you feel like they're not helping you as much as they could.

Don:

What are the upsides and the downsides of that? Obviously, when it's one record label, they put a lot of money into you because they know that as the artist grows, there's upside for them by having multiple record labels. Is there a downside to that, or does that give you more creative freedom?

Yussi:

Well, the whole multi-label thing for me is basically testing the waters with them.

Yussi:

Yeah, okay, so if I've just done a release with a label and I haven't done another one with them. It's usually because I don't feel like doing any more with them, whereas another one with them it's usually because I don't feel like doing any more with them, whereas there's a uk label, dnb active, who I did my album with last year. That didn't start with me giving them an album worth of tracks. I gave them one track and they put more budget into it and were better to work with and the track did better than any other track I'd done so. Then I did another single with them that did even better and then at that point I went okay, well, they're my best option at the moment. They're great to work with. They're actually putting budget behind the tracks, which before that I haven't really gotten, and that does a lot, especially when you're at the lower rungs.

Yussi:

Like you need that budget being put into the music for promotion just explain, elaborate on that for us.

Magnus:

What's budget behind the track?

Yussi:

uh, so when you put money or budget into a release, there's a bunch of different ways that you can spend that money, essentially to get more exposure on the song. For example, spotify offers some in-house sort of things, like you can pay a certain amount and it will. You know when you open Spotify and it might show this track is released today. Yeah, that's actually paid for by the artist team of the label.

Don:

Oh, wow, okay, Now what yeah?

Yussi:

that's actually paid for by the artist team of the label. Oh, wow, okay. Now what spotify offers is actually really not worth it. So we don't do that quite a lot.

Yussi:

But then there's other avenues, like you can have influencers and influencer pages on uh social media that will do posts with your music or in a way that promotes your music and you pay them. So that's a big thing. A big way that we spend money into promoting my music, especially with the label, is through content pages on instagram and on tiktok and you basically pay them to post a video or something with your track and you do this across multiple different channels and then, essentially because they're a lot of people in the scene of maybe following multiple uh channels like that, it starts. Your song starts popping up a lot more uh. You can pay radios to basically get you on and talk about it. You can. There's a whole bunch of different things, uh, without getting into it too much, but those are the main ones. It's essentially just putting money in to avenues that get your music seen by people so it's still marketing to a certain degree.

Magnus:

And how important is that? How important social media for you and for for your brand, oh, it's enormously important.

Yussi:

Yeah, if I haven't tracked the time I've spent of those 10 000, but at the beginning it was 100 music and towards the end it's like 60 40 with music and marketing. Wow. So as you get further up, you obviously you have to run it like a business, like anything else. You have to learn. You, the music is the product, the the marketing is what gets that product seen and bought by people. And I focused all my effort into the music side of things and got to a certain point in 2023 where I just it sort of wasn't getting past a certain point. I was making these really good tracks but they weren't getting seen by enough people to sort of hit that critical mass where it grows and grows. So then I started learning about marketing, which is a whole new skill you have to learn and social media marketing, and it took a while and it's not what you want to be doing. I don't want to be sitting there figuring out how to work the algorithm on instagram and and making content videos. But it gets easier and easier and you sort of hit a point where you just do it intuitively and you know what to do. You have an idea of how to create the content. You can do it efficiently.

Yussi:

And now, when I do a release for example back in the day, maybe two years ago a release promotion for me meant maybe put the song cover artwork up in a post saying it's coming out on friday, and then maybe there's like a visualizer. You know that you see on spotify and on the release day I say, hey, this is out now. Nowadays, when I release, I do maybe 10 to 12 different social media pieces that have a range of different formats, like one. One thing that works for me now is I get the feature vocalist to just lip sync the track and have a video of her basically singing the track, which we link with the instagram audio so that it's way more engaging. Like you, you have to. You can't just project the product nowadays, which is what you could do back in the day. You now have to make it entertaining for people, because when someone's flicking on their phone, why would they care about seconds?

Yussi:

right, they're gonna grab that yeah, they have an infinite source of entertaining media that they can flick through. Why are they going to stop on your video? Even though you've put your heart and soul into this track, they don't care. So you have to make them care, and then after that, the track needs to be good enough that they'll actually listen to it and keep listening to it. So it's like from both fronts. You have to, you have to. It's like from both fronts. You have to be good at making the music, but you have to be good at promoting the music. Same with any business you have to have a good product and a good way of marketing it.

Magnus:

Do you think AI automation are going to replace DJs and the automated mixing software that's around? Is there any threat to making DJs obsolete? Do you think in the future?

Yussi:

I think definitely. At the moment it's being used as a tool. So, for example, when I make a remix, I use AI websites which rip the vocal out of the original track and leave you with just the vocal, and then from there I have the vocal stem, which is what it's called, and then I write a new track underneath and then that's my remix. That's one way of using AI. You also have AI forms of sound design, which is where it can spit out different sounds which then you can piece together, but again, that's just replacing getting samples online.

Yussi:

So at the moment, there's a lot of forms of ai that are coming into different tools and aspects, and there's thousands of different things that go into making a track, and I think from that perspective, it's very healthy. And I and there's thousands of different things that go into making a track, and I think from that perspective, it's very healthy, and I think it's just another step forward in the technological advancement. Now the actual, where they actually just input some stuff and it produces a whole track for you. That's the bad side to it. That's where you can have issues and as that gets better and better, because it's already getting pretty good from what I've heard, I don't use it.

Ryan:

You have to take my word on that.

Yussi:

From what I've heard, it's getting better and better. I mean, I've even seen some full-on Spotify accounts pop up that just spit out AI-generated music and actually get a following on it. But something you always notice from it is that the release side of things and Spotify and the music that doesn't necessarily equally translate to getting show opportunities. Getting show opportunities and actually performing your art and getting to tour, which is the end goal essentially I was going to say it's, it's just all the elements coming together.

Don:

Yeah, it's still going to require human community.

Yussi:

Right, like people, people also. The thing is as a and a, I gets better and better at making music. The scene's also shifting at the moment to a point where people are more focused on the actual person rather than the music. So think fisher. You know, like fisher makes pretty good music, but a lot of people and the reason he's so massive is because of his personality. So now also it's another aspect is you can't just be a personality list, that's even a word personality I like you need to have a personality.

Yussi:

These days if you want to be an artist. You know gosh days where it's just the all black wearing. You know producer who doesn't really say much and just sort of projects and says you know this is the music, listen to it and people go oh my God, you know nowadays it's. You need to make the good music, you need to know how to release and how to market. You need to have a personality and a social media presence. So more and more the skills of being a music producer or the other skills involved in releasing and marketing and playing music, they're coming down to the producer. So you have to be sort of a one-stop shop I think you know.

Don:

Imagine what you could do with AI with that 10,000 hours you had right. It's about understanding how you use AI versus being afraid of AI.

Magnus:

Yeah, you've got to embrace and if you can do that and you have the right personality, it sounds like you are, because it's reducing a lot of those time-intensive activities that you need to be able to get it to where you got to get. Like you said, now you've got that ai software and you pull out the vocals and you're left with that, whereas in the past you might have to spend a few hours getting it to that point you were getting to that same point.

Yussi:

It was just taking a lot longer. Like you said, there's a lot of aspects like that in music production that you really know what you want. It's just about bypassing the technology to get there faster. I'm assuming that is what AI will do for the music industry. I'm hoping, but I can't see it being a situation where you suddenly just don't have artists and everyone's using AI.

Don:

But this is where you are setting yourself short. The music genius comes in. Right, you can't replace the music genius. The music genius will always find a way to make that better. Ai is always going to be able to create. You can't replace the music genius. The music genius will always find a way to make that better. Yeah, AI is always going to be able to create that repetitive large language model putting stuff together, scraping the internet.

Yussi:

Yeah.

Don:

It'll create new sounds, but the music genius will always find the artistry in it.

Yussi:

Yeah, and I think that's where we're going to that, plus the adhesion of the songs and music to the artists themselves. So yeah, from that standpoint, the fact that it's a lot more focused on the artist is something that will combat that.

Yussi:

And also these days, the thing is the ability of anyone to make a track these days is a lot better than what it was. So there's, you know, back in the day, when people sampled music, you would take little snippets of maybe, maybe you'd find a hip-hop song and it would be the first little bit of instrumental before the vocals come in. And then they would, they would sample that and that's how you know daft punk, for example. That's how they built their brand, that's how they made music and the prodigy and those sort of people they would those early electronic pioneers. They sampled old music and other music.

Yussi:

These days you can go onto an on a website online and you have a million sample packs and you can. You know when I go and get a sample for a song. Now I can perfectly type in the key of the sample. So, like the, the note the type of sample, whether it's a vocal, a drum, a bass, maybe something like that. I can put in more keywords and then you know. It basically refines your search and then you drag those in. So it's a lot easier to get what you want these days but again do it right.

Yussi:

Yeah, yeah again it's like, okay, well, still, if you put a million samples in front of an experienced producer, they're not going to be able to make what someone with years under their belt can do.

Don:

Mate, is this a myth or is this something I've always said? There's eight beats that you work with, right? Yeah, Is that true? Is that the eight beats you work with?

Yussi:

Yeah, so you've got like one, two, three, four, that's electronic music, music, yeah, so there's all regardless if it's an ai or a human.

Don:

There's only eight beats for you to work with, so it's always been easy for anyone if you wanted to do it, but I guess yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yussi:

I mean that's the thing, making music these days, compared to what it was 10 years ago or 20 years ago. We have so much more at our fingertips but still you don't see everyone being an A-list producer these days Also, the standard also goes up, you know, like, for example, what would have passed 10 years ago compared to what would have passed now. There's a lot of aspects where the music now it's a lot better, like from a mixing, mastering, and like a cleanliness of the track and like how well it hits on the speakers and all that. The stuff I'm making now is leagues ahead of what calvin harris, for example, was making 10 years ago. But the actual how catchy the music was and the music ability of what he makes, that's what makes. That's, in the end, what gets you to the big leagues.

Yussi:

It's making music that people just like listening to makes. That's what makes. That's, in the end, what gets you to the big leagues. It's making music that people just like listening to and that's catchy and that stays in their head. So as long as the technology keeps going, that's always going to be something that you know makes or breaks an artist, like how well composed their music is. It's not about how good the sounds are themselves music cuts through everything, right?

Don:

Have you seen that guy on Instagram and he's on all socials that goes and plays music to animals? You guys have to check this out.

Magnus:

You've got too much time on you.

Don:

I mean it's not time it's finding the right stuff to work with.

Yussi:

Remind searching. Yeah, that's it, you've got to learn how to search better.

Magnus:

What did you type in to get that yeah?

Don:

I think the system understands that I like this kind of really good stuff, but it's just like he goes in front of animals, starts playing music, right, and all these types of different animals, and we'll have to do a cut of this into this episode because it's absolutely amazing. What music does the people behind it like what you guys do? I don't think it's ever going to get superseded by technology. Yeah, but, what I want to know is like, what do you do when you're not making music right, like what?

Yussi:

I sleep.

Don:

No, seriously, like it seems like 10 000 hour you're putting all these hours in.

Yussi:

Yeah, it's pretty crazy. You have to be obsessed to really make it. I mean, maybe for some people it's different, but I think for the vast majority of people, and at least in my position, you just have to it has to be the thing you think about mostly, from when you wake up until you go to sleep, and it's not healthy?

Magnus:

not at all. What about from a health and fitness perspective? Because obviously you're locking yourself up into your cave, but I know you guys did a workout today.

Don:

Yeah, Mentally this is like you're using so much yeah.

Yussi:

No, it's good that you asked that question because I balance the unhealthy aspects of working so much on a computer and being locked in to making music with working out quite a lot. So I work out like six days a week. You know I try and get outside and get sun on me as much as I can. I'm very into my health and fitness and eating like that.

Yussi:

And you find a lot of artists as they get higher and higher, especially because then touring comes in, which is even less healthy. You know you're lacking sleep, you're around partying alcohol, drugs, all that sort of thing in different time zones, that you actually need to be really conscious of your health and you need to upkeep that. And I find, you know, when I have a couple of weeks where I'm, I have some deadlines hit with music and I put in more hours than I usually do and I take that away from maybe I skip a few workouts or don't eat as healthy. My mental health just starts dipping very quickly. So, and as time's gone on, I've learned to monitor both sides more. So I think balance there is a really really underrated thing that people don't think about and I say that you know, being someone who's put in all this all this time, constantly but, that's it.

Yussi:

The more I put time in music, the more I have to put time into health and fitness to to balance it out.

Magnus:

Really pleased about that because I think a lot of people in your position, like you said. You're around that party scene. You haven't got that balance where you've got it, mate, so well done.

Yussi:

Yeah yeah.

Don:

How do you deal with sleep? Like sleep is a huge part of you know wellness, right? Like you're in an industry where you have to, most of the stuff happens at night, right yeah yeah, well, I luckily not luckily, but I haven't done any major tours yet.

Yussi:

This Europe one for me will be the first one, but even then, you know, I'm going for three months. At the moment I have about seven or eight shows locked in, so it's like I'm playing one every week while I'm there. It's only once you get to the big leagues, when you're touring multiple shows per week and having to fly to different countries.

Magnus:

I think that's when it really impacts the sleep you know before, before that it's essentially like you could spend the whole week in a normal time zone, or you know, wake up, go to sleep, and then you just have a late night, on the night of the show. You'll have your own private jet then, so you better get a good night sleeping between shows not with what you've heard in music these days.

Yussi:

He is awesome.

Magnus:

We're gonna wrap things up. We run out of time to jump into the quickfire questions, all right. What's your go-to pump-up song before a set? Do you have one? I usually try not to listen to music. What's your dream?

Yussi:

festival to play at Ultra Music Festival in Miami and Tomorrowland. I can't say. Do you know if you're going to do any one of those coming up? I nearly got Tomorrowland this year. Yeah, next year, let's see.

Magnus:

You done? If you could erase one song from history that no DJ could ever play again, what would it be?

Yussi:

California Shai is like a melody. Yeah, that song. I nearly crashed my car listening to that because I got angry.

Magnus:

I hate it. Who's your biggest DJ inspiration?

Yussi:

It's so cliche, but I think for a while it was probably Skrillex, because in the electronic music scene he's just a god basically.

Magnus:

What's the worst request you've ever gotten from a crowd?

Yussi:

There's not a specific one, but I think it was just the over-request of Chris Brown back in the day when I was playing at his parties. Yeah, I couldn't get away from it. I just ended up having to play Chris Brown for half my set.

Magnus:

This is like If your career exploded overnight, you could become one of the biggest DJs in the world. What would be the first thing that you'd change about the industry?

Yussi:

What would I change about the industry? I think the problem with the industry at the moment for a lot of artists is the fact that it is so dependent on social media and all that, but I think that the industry is set up in a way that prioritizes that, so the labels focus on people who are doing better on socials and stuff rather than people making better music.

Yussi:

I think one thing I'll change about the industry is making other means of artists getting their music heard, so that the people with the good music have a better ability of shining through well said what's one genre that you secretly love but would never play live well, being a drum and bass dj, I can't really play anything other than drum and bass Secretly love.

Magnus:

Do you have a Swift?

Yussi:

No, a bit of Nicki Minaj goes hard though.

Magnus:

And would you rather headline a small packed underground club or an open, massive stadium Stadium? For sure, if you weren't a DJ, what would you?

Yussi:

be doing Probably civil engineering. Well, that's that. The first album or song that made you fall in love with music with music or with electronic music, electronic music, probably universes by shock one who's an australian drum bass artist.

Don:

It was his ep about 10 years ago because I don't know what the hell he's talking about. What made you fall in love with?

Yussi:

music. Well, I mean probably that Green Day album that had American Idiot and all that on it. I don't know. That was the first when I had a little little jukebox.

Ryan:

That was the first. You've played the Shock one as well, hey.

Yussi:

Yeah, he released my first EP, which was a really cool moment. Yeah, so that was sort of the first time it ticked over for me from being I'm producing and learning to produce to now I'm releasing artists. I'm going to release an EP with an artist whose music got me into that, so that was yeah, that was cool.

Magnus:

Yeah, good, Last question mate.

Ryan:

If you could collab with any artist, dead or alive, who would it be?

Yussi:

probably skrillex, everyone in the electronic scene will be watching this will be like shut up everyone I mean, I gotta say he's still on top in the electronic music scene, so he's so good. I feel like if you do a song with him, you also blow up but it's been fantastic.

Magnus:

I really appreciate it personally you coming in. I love your inspiration and, mate wish you all the best on that European tour.

Don:

Thanks so much. I had no idea what to expect, but this has been really interesting.

Yussi:

Yeah, no, thank you guys. I really appreciate you bringing me on and thank you for hassling me to come on. Yeah, I'm going to ask you to drag him out. I'm too much on the plate 30 tracks at the moment. Good luck on the tour.

Ryan:

Yeah, thank you, do you say you've got 30 tracks.

Yussi:

Yeah, I'm currently working on 30 different tracks. Wow, we'll wipe those up in the show notes for you, so our listeners can tell you yeah, oh yeah, for if anyone wants to find me on Spotify, it's Yussi Y-U-S-S-I. Same with SoundCloud, and then on socials, it's at Yossi Yossi, yossi on Instagram.

Don:

Yossi, yossi.

Yussi:

Yossi Yossi, yossi Yossi.

Don:

We'll make sure all those links are available. Yeah, awesome Cheers. Thanks everyone, thank you, thank you.

Magnus:

Hope you enjoyed this exciting episode of the Mastering Podcast. No-transcript.